Hydraulic FT issues/rumors?

-

Dragonbat13

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2012
Messages
379
Reaction score
18
Location
lake charles Louisiana
I recall reading a thread somewhere about hyd. FT lifters failing these days. Specifically from Comp. What's the deal on this? I have a comp xe262h cam I'm gonna be using soon and need to get new lifters. Going in a 78 360 block. I had planned on using Hughes 1110 springs and was gonna get lifters from them also. I see Hughes offers a standard and HD lifter. Will the HD lifters be worth the extra money? The heads are most likely going to be the stock heads off the 360, with a swap to some ootb speedmasters later for an increase in compression and better flow.

EDIT: this thread has all kinds of hydraulic flat tappet lifter questions I have. IDK how to edit the title.
 
Last edited:
As to the FTH lifters; some here say there are only a couple of lifter manufacturers around, and kindof think "they" are probably right.
As to the Hughes lifters; I bought them and the 1129 springs to go on their HE2330AL cam back in 2004. They have all been working well together ever since and that was about 60,000 miles ago.
As to their worth;Ima thinking that for me they are worth the upgrade, for two reasons,
1) I originally set the preload to about 1/4 turn, and that only lasted several thousand miles, after which they started ticking, So I reset the preload to 1/2 turn. This car, at that time, was a DD so when they began to tick a second time, I let them, because the engine was making more torque than ever. And the HD lifters have the circlip plunger retainer so they are designed to survive that, so I had no worries.
2) My engine has had the oiling mods done to it, so it has no problems with 7200, and so I test it every time I take it out.

Since the cost of upgrading to the HDs was minimal, it gave me this option, even tho my 230*cam probably powerpeaks at around 5400.
If you haven't heard your 360 screaming at 7000, you may never experience that horribly addicting sound; especially when the tach reads 7000 plus for two or three gears.
So yeah, to me those lifters were worth the extra coin.

Does your 262cam need them? probably not. But then I would get a rev-limiter. Because if you hit Neutral at say 5800 with your foot on the floor, that engine will hit 7000/8000 in less time than you can think what's going on, and react, to lift off. And if your engine does not have anti-pump-ups in it when the valve springs give up, well that could be catastrophic in several ways. So now those HD lifters would pay for themselves many many times over .
For me, being broke, the price difference in 2004 was less than a rev-limiter. And the first time I saw the tach-needle coming down past 8000 after a missed shift, with no apparent damage, I was one happy street-rodder; and of course , knowing what I then knew,lol, and having heard the Banshee Wail, 7200 became my new shift-rpm.
I know, I know, another long reply from AJ, complete with fluffed up rabbit-trails,unrelated info,and useless anecdotes; what can I say....You wanna hear about the Canaanite Giants, or GodAlmighty's description of the World we live in, as found in Job38?

BTW; that Comp 262 is a good sized street cam.With the 3.23sx 2.74=8.85 starter gear, it should pull real nice, If not, a 2800TC will wake her right up.


EDIT: Maybe I should mention that I tried to increase the oiling to my top end, in an effort to keep those valve springs cool. That top end is now spraying oil everywhere. I took advantage of that by drilling out the little pockets between each pair of lifters. Now some/most of that oil is draining into the cam tunnel. My hope was that some of it would flood the cam and then I would have no more flatted cams. And since 2004/5, I think I got it licked. With the HV pump, there seems to be lots of oil moving around. I also cut some drain-back channels in my Eddies at the back to improve drainage. I now have left and right heads. I had to go quite deep to make them half-decent effective.
 
Last edited:
Been seeing more HFT problems for about 15 years now in a very wide variety of them.... did not used to hardly ever see such issues. I'd suspect the quality control has gone downhill.
 
Here my new MP cam and lifters. Real quality.

Jake

3CEF61AE-F89A-4483-AD42-F821A5105257.jpeg


3F907B95-B83F-4C92-95D3-B5F221C53F86.jpeg


F60AB87E-8A58-414A-A39D-9027901535FD.jpeg
 
Supposedly an Erson cam and lifters installed by previous owner, no idea on how many miles on them prior or what year manufactured, but after 3 years and maybe 10,000 miles on sons 360 (78 Magnum) it developed the dreaded clack. Assumed a collapsed lifter or bad rocker arm. During manifold swap, lifter and rocker arm inspection we found one concave lifter face and rounded cam lobe. All others literally look like new.

FA06E8D3-57AC-4C62-99C7-BB07F8290C2A.jpeg


E27B963E-EDCF-44C6-AF8D-AE18C9002231.jpeg


392E1DD2-18C5-4563-9345-FE73CCECB4B9.jpeg
 
misguided
op low compression 360 and 262 cam I'd take a hard look at the Rhodes lifters with the extra oiling ask if regular or MAX
you own that cam?
 
This is crazy. Is it a common issue? What's the solution? Mechanical roller everything? Kinda pricy!

Are the days of reliable flat tappet hydraulic cams gone?

What's going on here?
 
misguided
op low compression 360 and 262 cam I'd take a hard look at the Rhodes lifters with the extra oiling ask if regular or MAX
you own that cam?

Yes I own the cam.

Thinking about shaving the heads to get the compression up. Even if I do those Rhodes lifters seem like a good idea. I had forgotten about those.

Car has 3.23 gears, Torqueflight 727 with factory common ratios, and I plan on getting a custom built 2800 stall convertor that will match the cam, trans, gear, tire size specs.
 
Last edited:
Johnson solids from a Chrysler slant Ebay sale. I asked for 4 more and they made me a set. They were Same as a 273 Dumb bell lifter! Put a white out mark on the top rim and watch to see if it turns on break-in. If it doesnt, stop motor and find out why.
 
Johnson solids from a Chrysler slant Ebay sale. I asked for 4 more and they made me a set. They were Same as a 273 Dumb bell lifter! Put a white out mark on the top rim and watch to see if it turns on break-in. If it doesnt, stop motor and find out why.

I always read about putting the white mark and watching the lifters rotate.

How do you do that without getting oil all over everything? Seems like an engine running at 2500 rpm would make a mess.

Once all of the lifters are inspected do you slam the covers on while it's running?

Appreciate the answers. I'm gonna go YouTube this also.

I've never broke in a cam the right way. I suppose we got lucky. I also don't have alot of engine builds under my belt.
 
b4 buying converter do you now have hp converter? if so run it and get a baseline, stall
 
I always read about putting the white mark and watching the lifters rotate.

How do you do that without getting oil all over everything? Seems like an engine running at 2500 rpm would make a mess.

Once all of the lifters are inspected do you slam the covers on while it's running?

Appreciate the answers. I'm gonna go YouTube this also.

I've never broke in a cam the right way. I suppose we got lucky. I also don't have alot of engine builds under my belt.
If you just turn the engine over by hand a few times with everything assembled except the intake, you should be able to see the lifters and pushrods rotate. Even if it is just a little bit, that is what you need to see. They will rotate with different speeds, but that is all OK, as long as each and every one rotates.

If you want to see it when running, then get some beat up valve covers and cut rectangular slots in the tops and put them on. Mark the pushrods and watch for them to rotate.

If a pushrod is not rotating, then its lifter is not rotating...... the lifter is the only source of rotational motion on the pushrod.
 
And BTW, the lifter issues we've been seeing having been in noisy, tapping, collapsing lifters. Have not had one chew itself or the lobe to bits.
 
Stock rebuild is the only thing I would put a hyd lifter in and even that I might change the rockers and go solid flat tappet. If you have performance goals for this engine I see adjustable rockers in your future anyway. You check to see if the lifter rotates with the valve train adjusted and the intake off. You turn the motor over by hand. If they all rotate by just hand rotating the engine they should be fine. Solid flat tappet with EDM hole in lifter face is what I run.
 
After having a 360 munch two lifters, I solved the problem handily.

And I suggest you run a roller cam as well. There's no reason not to besides cost, many additional benefits, and cost means nothing when the motor goes to scrap bin because it's full of filings.
 
do roller cams work harden themselves in the lobes? Id try a roller regrind off a stock blank but I thought the lobes had to be hardened? Maybe that's a FT thing. rollers provide less friction but a proper hydrodynamic wedge provides little to no metal to metal contact in a floating bearing. Cams may be different with its pulsation type load, especially a solid.
 
EDIT: Maybe I should mention that I tried to increase the oiling to my top end, in an effort to keep those valve springs cool. That top end is now spraying oil everywhere. I took advantage of that by drilling out the little pockets between each pair of lifters. Now some/most of that oil is draining into the cam tunnel. My hope was that some of it would flood the cam and then I would have no more flatted cams. And since 2004/5, I think I got it licked. With the HV pump, there seems to be lots of oil moving around. I also cut some drain-back channels in my Eddies at the back to improve drainage. I now have left and right heads. I had to go quite deep to make them half-decent effective.
 
do roller cams work harden themselves in the lobes? Id try a roller regrind off a stock blank but I thought the lobes had to be hardened? Maybe that's a FT thing. rollers provide less friction but a proper hydrodynamic wedge provides little to no metal to metal contact in a floating bearing. Cams may be different with its pulsation type load, especially a solid.
Different (harder) material used for a roller cam IIRC
 
  1. posted this in Krooser's thread- sorry buddy

  2. There are no real good cast flat tappet cores for the 360 chrysler, so I'd go with the hydraulic roller.

    As long as you're planning to stay below 6,500, you'll be happy with the HR cam.

    Mike Jones 10 years ago- still true???

 
-
Back
Top