Indy 360-1 vs Edelbrock RPM heads

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pittsburghracer said:
Here’s Hugh’s flow numbers. Are they even still available and how much did they cost.

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These are the numbers I found and what they were sold under as being. IntKe listed first, exhaust second.

The price I paid included on sale pricing on the CNC porting on brand new heads. I don’t remember what the total price was but I remember the math I did and savings over the CNC half sale price and the heads purchased on sale equaled about a 40% savings over there full price. These were done a good while back and not applicable to todays pricing.

Sorry I can not be more helpful on this.

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There pretty conservative on the power possibilities of the stock head of 417 hp compared to their CNC super prep with gains of 20+ cfms on low lifts for an estimated 540 hp.
 
273 said:
There pretty conservative on the power possibilities of the stock head of 417 hp compared to their CNC super prep with gains of 20+ cfms on low lifts for an estimated 540 hp.
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Layman’s rule? CFM X’s 2 = potential power.
258 rounded up .1 cfm.
258 X’s 2 = 516 HP. There est. is 540, 24 hp more, that’s doable.
Conservative? I guess that depends on how far you want to push it. The cfm X’s 2 is good for guys in the street looking for a good & respectable outcome or a casual but quick bracket racers.

What do you suppose? Thoughts?
 
My point was they only rated the stock Edelbrock head for 417 hp, (1.61 hp per cfm)
rumblefish360 said:
Layman’s rule? CFM X’s 2 = potential power.
258 rounded up .1 cfm.
258 X’s 2 = 516 HP. There est. is 540, 24 hp more, that’s doable.
Conservative? I guess that depends on how far you want to push it. The cfm X’s 2 is good for guys in the street looking for a good & respectable outcome or a casual but quick bracket racers.

What do you suppose? Thoughts?
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I find most builds we see fall short of the 2hp per cfm, 1.7-1.9 hp per cfm for 230-250 ish cammed engines.
 
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273 said:
My point was they only rated the stock Edelbrock head for 417 hp, (1.61 hp per cfm)
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I think you misunderstand. If “They” is Edelbrock. The head is not rated for that level but the power package is.
273 said:
I find most builds we see fall short of the 2hp per cfm, 1.7-1.9 hp per cfm for 230-250 ish cammed engines.
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Oh yeah! But then again, no one is trying for it.
 
If a one would purchase and use Edelbrock heads as cast, OOTB, it would take a lot more than what most people would want to use on the street to obtain the X’2-cfm math potential outcome. Not what the head is marketed and geared for. I have no doubt you could make excellent use of the as cast head.
 
I know Hughes was having problems getting help in the shop recently.
I don’t see the BM listed currently on the list of cylinder head options there.
I wonder if they’re actually available.
And if so, how much.
The non-BM cnc porting option from them is just over $1700.

That’s puts the cnc’d non-BM heads at over $3600, plus the cost of the spring/retainer/lock upgrades needed for the 550+hp cam.

Of course, you don’t need 300cfm heads to make solidly over 550hp.
 
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PRH said:
I know Hughes was having problems getting help in the shop recently.
I don’t see the BM listed currently on the list of cylinder head options there.
I wonder if they’re actually available.
And if so, how much.
The non-BM cnc porting option from them is just over $1700.

That’s puts the cnc’d non-BM heads at over $3600, plus the cost of the spring/retainer/lock upgrades needed for the 550+hp cam.

Of course, you don’t need 300cfm heads to make solidly over 550hp.
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Honestly, it just makes the trick flows look like an even better deal than they already are, especially if you want to bolt them on and go.

It's too bad there isn't an intermediate jump after the TFs. With the Indy 360-x, By the time you pay for the CNC porting and bolts/rockers/shafts/pushrods, you're up over $5000.
 
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TurboGLH said:
Honestly, it just makes the trick flows look like an even better deal than they already are, especially if you want to bolt them on and go.

It's too bad there isn't an intermediate jump after the TFs. By the time you pay for the CNC porting and bolts/rockers/shafts/pushrods, you're up over $5000.
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At this point in time, YES! Then there is a time when TF wasn’t even entertaining the idea of a SBM head. Any street build I’d start from scratch now would get the TF heads.

A strip build would be a different head.
 
PRH said:
I know Hughes was having problems getting help in the shop recently.
I don’t see the BM listed currently on the list of cylinder head options there.
I wonder if they’re actually available.
And if so, how much.
The non-BM cnc porting option from them is just over $1700.

That’s puts the cnc’d non-BM heads at over $3600, plus the cost of the spring/retainer/lock upgrades needed for the 550+hp cam.

Of course, you don’t need 300cfm heads to make solidly over 550hp.
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Even getting answers on e-mails is taking longer than in the past.... this is what I experienced ...
 
rumblefish360 said:
At this point in time, YES! Then there is a time when TF wasn’t even entertaining the idea of a SBM head. Any street build I’d start from scratch now would get the TF heads.

A strip build would be a different head.
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Interesting.... I have seen and came across sufficient data and info that the TF's can be a good option too..

My car will be 550 to 600 hp, Strip and very minor street...... ( about 80 % strip and 20% street, for illustration purposes. ) Where do you draw the line to consider a strip engine??
 
Now that’s a great question! It’s also a variable one for myself and truly dependent on my goal for the car itself. The burning question is how much street time will it actually honestly see?

Example #1! My ‘71 strip Duster. Will see very limited street time.
The build is set up for a stroker W2 and a cam of or at a north of 260*’s at 050, lots of stall and gear, the goal is 9 seconds.

Example #2! Street strip ‘74 Duster. Will built very similar with W2 heads. This is a car that will see approximately a 50/50 thing. The cam and compression will be smaller and less, not so brutal of a cam stick. Gearing will be 4.30’s. I’ll cruise around these Florida back roads and minor arteries at a max of 40/45 mph.

Example #3! Wife ‘67, total street car. 11.3-1, 360 w/TF heads, RPM intake, 750, TTI exhaust stem to stern, small hydraulic roller cam with .573 lift, tight converter and 3.55’s. It has hauled the mail above 140 mph on the Hwy. Track times yet to be sorted out. I need to get back to the track but I’m piled up with garbage.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Now that’s a great question! It’s also a variable one for myself and truly dependent on my goal for the car itself. The burning question is how much street time will it actually honestly see?

Example #1! My ‘71 strip Duster. Will see very limited street time.
The build is set up for a stroker W2 and a cam of or at a north of 260*’s at 050, lots of stall and gear, the goal is 9 seconds.

Example #2! Street strip ‘74 Duster. Will built very similar with W2 heads. This is a car that will see approximately a 50/50 thing. The cam and compression will be smaller and less, not so brutal of a cam stick. Gearing will be 4.30’s. I’ll cruise around these Florida back roads and minor arteries at a max of 40/45 mph.

Example #3! Wife ‘67, total street car. 11.3-1, 360 w/TF heads, RPM intake, 750, TTI exhaust stem to stern, small hydraulic roller cam with .573 lift, tight converter and 3.55’s. It has hauled the mail above 140 mph on the Hwy. Track times yet to be sorted out. I need to get back to the track but I’m piled up with garbage.
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Well my car leans pretty much to your Example # 1... very limited street time, and the goal is to run low 10's high 9's all motor on my 2900 lbs car. Bracket car focused...

And sporadically use of nitrous to run low to mid 9's
 
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Dang, that’s hit send before I was done.

Example #3! I have a set of well ported W5’s which will reside on top of a stroker and be a pump gas enabled engine. It’ll use the same 271@050 the first W2 Duster is using…. Maybe….
(I seen a nice roller another member is using recently and it’s sweet, so, I may go for the expense. Time will tell. I want to make it a big bore application.
 
Jax said:
Well my car leans pretty much to your Example # 1... very limited street time, and the goal is to run low 10's high 9's all motor on my 2900 lbs car. Bracket car focus...

And sporadically use of nitrous to run low to mid 9's
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That’s about my Duster as it sits now. I’m a little lighter, just a little. It’ll be lightened up more later. Garage first! 30 X 40 coming soon. I’d like to get deep into the 9’s on motor alone. I’ll call it good from there. No N02. I’ll follow the 5C rule and get there easy enough. (Driver dependent and hindered! LOL!)
 
rumblefish360 said:
That’s about my Duster as it sits now. I’m a little lighter, just a little. It’ll be lightened up more later. Garage first! 30 X 40 coming soon. I’d like to get deep into the 9’s on motor alone. I’ll call it good from there. No N02. I’ll follow the 5C rule and get there easy enough. (Driver dependent and hindered! LOL!)
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Nice, based on this.... which set up would you recommend me... Indy? Eddys? TF? and up to what extend...
 
Strip only? Indy, oval or rectangle, your call.
There’s some fellas here that run small block Indy heads. A few run Jesel or TR rockers in them over the Indy brand.
 
Oh, extend? Extent? I’m not following.
 
Each place will have their own CNC program. How well anyone’s is I just don’t know. The Hughes BM heads are over done and I understand why. They’re not what I’d use on a strip only engine. Nor street. They can on top an engine like a 414 or greater stroker and be OK.

On a strip only deal, there is the W9, Indy Cylinder head and if Edelbrock ever makes the Victor head again, that would be a serious consideration to look into.

Here’s food for thought. Head porter Brett Miller can get over 1,000 NA hp from W9 heads. Will that do ya?
 
rumblefish360 said:
Now that’s a great question! It’s also a variable one for myself and truly dependent on my goal for the car itself. The burning question is how much street time will it actually honestly see?

Example #1! My ‘71 strip Duster. Will see very limited street time.
The build is set up for a stroker W2 and a cam of or at a north of 260*’s at 050, lots of stall and gear, the goal is 9 seconds.

Example #2! Street strip ‘74 Duster. Will built very similar with W2 heads. This is a car that will see approximately a 50/50 thing. The cam and compression will be smaller and less, not so brutal of a cam stick. Gearing will be 4.30’s. I’ll cruise around these Florida back roads and minor arteries at a max of 40/45 mph.

Example #3! Wife ‘67, total street car. 11.3-1, 360 w/TF heads, RPM intake, 750, TTI exhaust stem to stern, small hydraulic roller cam with .573 lift, tight converter and 3.55’s. It has hauled the mail above 140 mph on the Hwy. Track times yet to be sorted out. I need to get back to the track but I’m piled up with garbage.
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Wow super nice builds! Example #3 has gone 140 with 3.55's? Can 3.91's do that too or is that wishing for alot?
 
QuickDart360 said:
Wow super nice builds! Example #3 has gone 140 with 3.55's? Can 3.91's do that too or is that wishing for alot?
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Whoops! Typo! 130 mph, not 140 mph. The guy in the Mustang told me so. He didn’t think I could keep pace. It was scary. The new exhaust was configured with a new to me “X” pipe and made some wicked sounds keeping me out of it on the first time I was opening up the throttle. I got to about 6K-RPM and it sounded like a Banshee in my ear.

Here’s the thing with speed, it’s coupled with tire size and rpm. Can you? Sure! Is it a good idea? How well did you build your engine?

Gear ratio X Tire diameter X RPM and assuming a 1:1 trans ratio in drive….
3.91 X 28 X 6500 = 140 mph? Which also assumes no converter slippage and enough to power through the wall of air at speed.
I’m sure the RPM’s go up due to converter slippage and pushing the air out of the way.

Sit down with a calculator. Run some numbers.
 
QuickDart360 said:
Wow super nice builds!
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OH! Thanks. Just trying to have some fun.

Replicarracer43 and I have had some chats. A way back, I bought a short deck R3 59* block from him and let it sit around here for the future. After talking for awhile, I’m going to do a 3.58 stroke big bore combo for 380 ci. Run roller & the W2 w/a single 4.
Just let it rip!

The other I want an oversized mill. 434ci is the target. It’ll be “perfectly ridiculous” on the street with a tunnel ram & track visits as often as life allows.

The wife’s ‘67 Cúda is a street performer. Not crazy by any standard. It moves pretty OK and will RPM pretty high since the cylinder heads allow for power up top pretty well. It really needs more stall and gear for it to move out well. But she likes it the way it is power wise.
 
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