Learning to paint....

[barbee6043]

^^^^^ LIke the time I left the chain saw with the "kid" with instructions of have all those logs made into firewood before I returned.
Get back and there are two sticks, I pull the cord, and it goes BRrrrrrr and he says "Whats that noise BOSS!???" ha

 

[Cuda416]

This thread has produced a lot of info for me, but one thing I thought about today was what "kind" of paint to use. Acrylic used to be the thing I think, then poly was all the rage. What's the best thing for a beginner to use that's not a single stage?

With my son going to boot camp soon, I'm thinking of doing the paint while he's gone. If not while he's at boot, then while he's at school. Most schools in the corps won't allow cars so I'll have the car for at least a year longer.

 

[sscuda]

PPG's Shop Line Acrylic Urethane (single stage 2 component) is very forgiving. As a matter of fact I'm painting my 3 year old grand daughter's metal Radio Flyer wagon with it this week. Hot pink of course!!!!

 

[sireland67]

PPG Shop line is good paint, I blended my boys 97 Stratus with it.
Matched great

 

[Cuda416]

Alright, nothing exciting but we're going to try and spray some epoxy primer/sealer (Omni) over the inside of of the car on the new floor and tops of the frame connectors. After which, we'll install the rest of the floor and do it again to cover that as well.

Planning on using the HF purple gun cuz I can toss it if it gunks up. I've already taken it apart and cleaned all the adhesive out of it with lacquer thinner. The tip is 1.4, but it's been suggested to drill it out to 5/64 (1.98mm) for epoxy.

Any suggestions before I pull the trigger, literally?

NOTE: PPE is in place. I'll be wearing a 3M 7502 with 6001 cartridges.

 

[blewbyoutobad]

All I can tell you is stick with a name brand. Theres a reason why brand names cost more than imported junk. Research and development rather than some company just trying to copy a brand name and you are the guinea pig. Nason (Axalta/Dupont) like Shop Line (PPG) are two good lines at a lower cost. Dimension is a lower cost Sherwin Williams. If its cheap stay away from it. If you buy a cheap basecoat and it doesnt cover good where is the savings when you have to stop buy more paint, plus your time window is shut by the time you get paint and return to the job. Now you have to scuff the base coat and start all over. There is an O Reilly store 15 minutes from me that mixes and sells the Nason line. List price for a gallon of charcoal gray (Mustang) is $200. You still need clear, sealer, hardener and reducer, just to name a few of the materials. Clean the surface with a wax and grease remover before shooting and when you think you have it clean, clean it again then tack it right before you shoot. Just finished the Dart yesterday. I used Sherwin Williams CC 200 for the clear. Also a word of advice you had better start color sanding 24 hours after the shoot if you plan on buffing. These new clears get hard really quick. A friend gave this new high end car cover after he sold his SS. Fits perfect and no one will steal it once they see the Logo LOL.

 

[blewbyoutobad]

Alright, nothing exciting but we're going to try and spray some epoxy primer/sealer (Omni) over the inside of of the car on the new floor and tops of the frame connectors. After which, we'll install the rest of the floor and do it again to cover that as well.

Planning on using the HF purple gun cuz I can toss it if it gunks up. I've already taken it apart and cleaned all the adhesive out of it with lacquer thinner. The tip is 1.4, but it's been suggested to drill it out to 5/64 (1.98mm) for epoxy.

Any suggestions before I pull the trigger, literally?

NOTE: PPE is in place. I'll be wearing a 3M 7502 with 6001 cartridges.

Make sure you have a good gun when you spray the sealer base and clear, otherwise all you work will be for vain.

 

[Cuda416]

Make sure you have a good gun when you spray the sealer base and clear, otherwise all you work will be for vain.

Yessir, My version of a 'good gun" is the DeVilbiss FLG4. I'll use that for everything else.

This spray isn't for base cote, just getting some epoxy down to protect what we've done. Later, when he's at boot camp, I'm thinking of surprising him with a paint job.

 

[Cuda416]

All I can tell you is stick with a name brand. Theres a reason why brand names cost more than imported junk. Research and development rather than some company just trying to copy a brand name and you are the guinea pig. Nason (Axalta/Dupont) like Shop Line (PPG) are two good lines at a lower cost. Dimension is a lower cost Sherwin Williams. If its cheap stay away from it. If you buy a cheap basecoat and it doesnt cover good where is the savings when you have to stop buy more paint, plus your time window is shut by the time you get paint and return to the job. Now you have to scuff the base coat and start all over. There is an O Reilly store 15 minutes from me that mixes and sells the Nason line. List price for a gallon of charcoal gray (Mustang) is $200. You still need clear, sealer, hardener and reducer, just to name a few of the materials. Clean the surface with a wax and grease remover before shooting and when you think you have it clean, clean it again then tack it right before you shoot. Just finished the Dart yesterday. I used Sherwin Williams CC 200 for the clear. Also a word of advice you had better start color sanding 24 hours after the shoot if you plan on buffing. These new clears get hard really quick. A friend gave this new high end car cover after he sold his SS. Fits perfect and no one will steal it once they see the Logo LOL.

View attachment 1715645410

View attachment 1715645411

View attachment 1715645412

View attachment 1715645413

That's bad ***

 

[blewbyoutobad]

That's bad ***

Yes sir, primer guns are 3 - 4 tip sizes bigger than color and clear. Sounds like you are set.

 

[ESP47]

Alright, nothing exciting but we're going to try and spray some epoxy primer/sealer (Omni) over the inside of of the car on the new floor and tops of the frame connectors. After which, we'll install the rest of the floor and do it again to cover that as well.

Planning on using the HF purple gun cuz I can toss it if it gunks up. I've already taken it apart and cleaned all the adhesive out of it with lacquer thinner. The tip is 1.4, but it's been suggested to drill it out to 5/64 (1.98mm) for epoxy.

Any suggestions before I pull the trigger, literally?

NOTE: PPE is in place. I'll be wearing a 3M 7502 with 6001 cartridges.

I would look at the manufactures needle size recommendations for that epoxy. Normally epoxy is pretty thin and is shot with something closer to 1.4. Going up to almost 2.0 seems way out of line of any epoxies I've read about so far. But each manufacturer is different. Usually you can find the answers on auto body forums if the manufacturer makes it difficult to find.

 

[Cuda416]

I would look at the manufactures needle size recommendations for that epoxy. Normally epoxy is pretty thin and is shot with something closer to 1.4. Going up to almost 2.0 seems way out of line of any epoxies I've read about so far. But each manufacturer is different. Usually you can find the answers on auto body forums if the manufacturer makes it difficult to find.

Good point. I'll look at the paperwork. Maybe I was thinking of high build primer with the tip drilling.

 

[Cuda416]

Good point. I'll look at the paperwork. Maybe I was thinking of high build primer with the tip drilling.

Glad it was mentioned. OMNI docs say 1.3 - 1.6 tip. I'll leave the 1.4 alone.

 

[barbee6043]

Always go to the tech sheet as every co.'s material, they are all different as far as everything!!!!
Lot of people on this site love Southern Polyurethanes, I do also. They have a tech guy that is great help for as their products and people like me that 's not a pro!!
I've had pro's tell me, the important part no doubt, is using the best topcoat you an afford and then just GOOD primers and fillers, they do not have to be the most expensive. I think the better fillers are worth the extra $ as it am crap at that part!!!! ha

 

[sireland67]

Alright, nothing exciting but we're going to try and spray some epoxy primer/sealer (Omni) over the inside of of the car on the new floor and tops of the frame connectors. After which, we'll install the rest of the floor and do it again to cover that as well.

Planning on using the HF purple gun cuz I can toss it if it gunks up. I've already taken it apart and cleaned all the adhesive out of it with lacquer thinner. The tip is 1.4, but it's been suggested to drill it out to 5/64 (1.98mm) for epoxy.

Any suggestions before I pull the trigger, literally?

NOTE: PPE is in place. I'll be wearing a 3M 7502 with 6001 cartridges.

The purple gun will shoot it ok.

 

[blewbyoutobad]

I would look at the manufactures needle size recommendations for that epoxy. Normally epoxy is pretty thin and is shot with something closer to 1.4. Going up to almost 2.0 seems way out of line of any epoxies I've read about so far. But each manufacturer is different. Usually you can find the answers on auto body forums if the manufacturer makes it difficult to find.

Epoxy is not a primer. A larger tip would be for heavier bodied sandable primer. In the old days we used epoxy for a sealer with a little thinning and to protect bare metal .

 

[Cuda416]

Epoxy is not a primer. A larger tip would be for heavier bodied sandable primer. In the old days we used epoxy for a sealer with a little thinning and to protect bare metal .

Yup, of that I am aware. I use the term "primer" generically, but I know it is in fact, a sealer. I only know that because "My friend Pete" from "South West Rod and Customs", made a video in which he probably re-iterated the fact about 4 bajillion times. lol...

 

[barbee6043]

Epoxy is listed as primer, add reducer it becomes a sealer. Someone explain if I am wrong. I think of sealer going on before the toppoat, and the epoxy primer as the base over bare metal, and before filler.
Generally epoxy is not sandable, but SPI epoxy is sandable for instance. .
There are also Urethane primers, and polyester primers that are for high builds and self leveling.
Be aware with the gravity gun, there is a lifter at the base of the cup, that sometimes needs to be remove if shooting a thick material.
This all is just my opinion.

 

[Cuda416]

Epoxy is not a primer. A larger tip would be for heavier bodied sandable primer. In the old days we used epoxy for a sealer with a little thinning and to protect bare metal .

So this is contrary to what I've seen, in that I thought the bare metal coats were done straight 1:1, no thinning, two med-wet coats. Do body work, spot spray as you go along, then high build, block sand, then seal with epoxy again, "thinned" to lay down a smooth layer, then BC/CC.

Is that not right? Variations for different scenarios?

 

[Cuda416]

Epoxy is listed as primer, add reducer it becomes a sealer. Someone explain if I am wrong. I think of sealer going on before the toppoat, and the epoxy primer as the base over bare metal, and before filler.
Generally epoxy is not sandable, but SPI epoxy is sandable for instance. .
There are also Urethane primers, and polyester primers that are for high builds and self leveling.
Be aware with the gravity gun, there is a lifter at the base of the cup, that sometimes needs to be remove if shooting a thick material.
This all is just my opinion.

Agreed, that's my interpretation too. But I'm the low guy on the totem pole here so I'll defer to everyone else.

 

[blewbyoutobad]

Epoxy is listed as primer, add reducer it becomes a sealer. Someone explain if I am wrong. I think of sealer going on before the toppoat, and the epoxy primer as the base over bare metal, and before filler.
Generally epoxy is not sandable, but SPI epoxy is sandable for instance. .
There are also Urethane primers, and polyester primers that are for high builds and self leveling.
Be aware with the gravity gun, there is a lifter at the base of the cup, that sometimes needs to be remove if shooting a thick material.
This all is just my opinion.

All epoxy primer requires a hardener or activator. It would not be epoxy without it. Because it is a thin film build there is no reason to sand it except to scuff it for adhesion before spraying anything else on top of it.

 

[blewbyoutobad]

So this is contrary to what I've seen, in that I thought the bare metal coats were done straight 1:1, no thinning, two med-wet coats. Do body work, spot spray as you go along, then high build, block sand, then seal with epoxy again, "thinned" to lay down a smooth layer, then BC/CC.

Is that not right? Variations for different scenarios?

Correct you can thin it a little if you want to use it as a sealer before you spray color. Let it sit a few minutes, but I would not do this in this day of much better materials. Your sealer should be the same brand as you color and clear. Mix brands and ask for trouble.

 

[barbee6043]

^^Common as dirt to add a reducer to the Epoxy primer and use tahtas that as sealer.
Yes Epoxy primers use an activator.
Not sure what is the the aerosol cans!!! ha
Bur a can't go by me, I have used single state acrylic urethane as my base, and then bought someone else company's clear!!!! ha

 

[Cuda416]

Well it's not much, but we sprayed epoxy out of that purple gun and it didn't suck. It was only epoxy but hey, a win is a win. Part of this is getting the process down and getting comfortable with things.

My son says he wants to eventually paint the car "Maroon" and has give me an example of a 2018 Jeep with Deep Cherry Red (PRP code). Not really Maroon, but I think he's talking about burgundy so this is close.

I'm thinking of painting it as a surprise while he's away, If I can get it done before he comes home for boot leave, it means I'll have about 15 weeks from the time he goes away. If they are cutting leave from C19, I'll have longer.

For materials, I plan on getting...

1 gallon epoxy primer/sealer
1 gallon high build 2k primer
1 gallon of paint with appropriate reducer
1 gallon of clear (if I do a BC/CC)

Of course I'll get the mixing stuff etc.

Seems there are a lot of good products out there and some crap. I'd like to stack the deck in my favor so I'm looking for recommendations for "brands" to look for.

So far, I see...

PPG (king o fthe hill?)
- Shopline
- Uline (differences from S/L ?)
SPI (epoxy, other?)
Sherwin Williams (Nason?)

I think at this point, I'd rather go BC/CC than SS. My understanding is it's a more durable overall finish and if I screw something up along the way, it's more forgiving to fix?

Anyway, all input is appreciated.

 

[sireland67]

I used Shopline on my son's 97 Stratus, it was an excellent match, I had to paint the hood, fender and two doors.
It blended nice on rear door, and panel matched the hood to the fender.
For an OEM color match I will use it again.