No spark and i can only get 5V at the coil.

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Worn distributor will probably be my next issue. But the 5.7 hemi swap isnt too far from now.

In the aircraft world they dont usually pass through multiple owner who cut and paste what they thing should be ok and then just wrap electrical tape around things and call it good. There is a compeltely different level of professionalism amungst the aviation crowd. So while checking fuses and such works at the aviation level it doesnt work in the classic car level. No way shape or form do they compare to a 40 year old mopar. I know that and i just started into Mopars.


I know that firing up after a long slumber feeling all to well since i picked up this Dart im afraid. So i dont end on a sour note, Thank you everyone for all your help I greatly appreciate you all lending a hand to bring me into the Mopar world. .
 
YoungDart75 said:
I know i didnt mention you indiviually, but between you and the other two, thats where the most helpful information came from. But 67Dart provided the diagrams and the that led to the faulty part, and nm9 contact me via phone and messages helping the effort along specifically in the right direction.
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I was only kidding about that:)
 
67Dart273 said:
The thing is his wiring IS AFU. And in my experience, a bad ECU has been RARELY the problem in a failed Mopar ignition. In my experience the problems have been

Bad ballast

Bad connections at the distributor pickup

Bad distributor pickup or strike damage on the reluctor (usually worn distributor)

Misc wiring problems usually bad connections AT CONNECTORS

and last.................a bad ECU

Now bear in mind, this is "mostly before" the chineseoisasssssification of replacement parts, so that might bias the results
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I can agree with that, but conversely, in my experience it's always been ECU's, and 1 pickup module. I guess the thing to do is use the K.I.S.S. rule.
 
Indeed it is. I have an ocd thing that keeps me from moving on from wiring that looks like that.
 
there are some 45 year old mopars out here with good original wiring. like my 1970 vs29h0 Duster, I am the 3rd owner, bought it in 1981 for $1000. all original unmolested wiring, original alternator, no problems. then there are cars of all makes that have been owned by monkeys
 
Marcohotrod said:
there are some 45 year old mopars out here with good original wiring. like my 1970 vs29h0 Duster, I am the 3rd owner, bought it in 1981 for $1000. all original unmolested wiring, original alternator, no problems. then there are cars of all makes that have been owned by monkeys
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Here's the thing. LOTS of guys on here have had Mopars with original UNhacked wiring, but it had bad connections, burned, overheated, corroded, etc, and these are typically in the bulkhead connector, the ignition switch, and the headlight switch. Followed by anything else you can name, including heater / AC and TS switch.

If all you guys wanna do is throw parts at it, you need not have experience, knowledge, or any real troubleshooting ability. But you WILL have to have a lot of money, because you will be spending a lot. Worse, sometimes you throw a new part on, with a so-so connector, and it works---for awhile.

And if that's what you want to do, you don't need this board, or people who really do have an understanding of how these work.

And......they don't have to be old, either. "In a previous life," when most of you guys PARENTS weren't of age yet, I was harrassing people in San Diego in a 64 Dodge, or 69 RR, or a 70 V code. In other words a hell of a long time ago. The 70 bulkhead connector gave me trouble when the car was less than 5 years old, and certainly had never been in the rust belt!!!

There IS a time for throwing parts---when you are really really stumped, "best guess." Sometimes, that actually works.
 
Precisely youngdart, poor service and operating conditions,as well as improper
repairs add up to things aircraft should not experience.( I said SHOULD Not?!!)
That being said,new cars of today and yesteryear have all routinely suffered
from wiring fails.Vehicles are mass produced,and so are the harnesses installed
in them,by humans who are not perfect.Having taken My 1st tech job at a dealer
30 yrs. ago,I could tell you hundreds of stories citing pinched/cut harnesses,tons
of pushed out terminations from their connector,poorly designed/placed connections
subjecting them to corrosion etc. on & on. If you have a shelf of freebie test pieces
and they are quickly changed,I guess you can afford to be lazy 'till you are forced
to actually diagnose the prob., when you run out of parts.
Mopars elec. ign. is quickly and easily diagnosed if all the basics are in good cond.
There are times when a system is complicated,and accessibility so restricted,that
the part is less expense than the labor involved thus actually a better call for the
customer's sake. All in all,glad you will be able to enjoy your ride,cheers!!:coffee2:
 
YoungDart75 said:
I dont think you were right in any case because you never actually gave any helpful information.

I work on 15 million dollar weapon systems when im on sea duty, and i can tell you right now I wouldnt move on in my trouble shooting until fixing the wiring that looked this bad. I hope to god if you come across wiring that looks like this did, whether its an airplane or a go kart you fix it before you move on. I say this mainly because alot of people get in deep to trouble shooting they forget to go back and fix these kinds of things until they cause another problem.
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Haha. If you guys go straight to wiring to solve problems please don't ever do this for a living. Wether the wiring looked f-d up or not. I never said replace the parts. I said check them out. You always, always go to components first. After making sure everything is getting correct power to them. Which would take all of 2 minutes. Helpful is stopping you from pulling you out of the mess you were in by tearing wiring out. I work on much more than 15 mil worth a crap and have for over 20 years. I actually work for Nasa now. I hope I know what I'm doing... This is assuming you know the part is good after you check it out. You can spend a couple of hours and fix the car the right way or spend a week shooting wires that are just fine.
 
64cudaV8 said:
Haha. If you guys go straight to wiring.
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You are arguing bullshit. Just stop already. Nobody said "the wiring is what the problem is" what we SAID is do some checks before you throw parts at it. That SEEMS to be your strategy.
 
67Dart273 said:
You are arguing bullshit. Just stop already. Nobody said "the wiring is what the problem is" what we SAID is do some checks before you throw parts at it. That SEEMS to be your strategy.
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I never once said to replace any parts without checking them out first. You had him shooting wires all over the damn place. :finga:
 
64cudaV8 said:
I never once said to replace any parts without checking them out first. You had him shooting wires all over the damn place. :finga:
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Just stop. Stop it. Just stop.

stop-loss-strategy.jpg
 
LOL well an fsm WOULD help, but you have to use what's called critical thinking when working on cars.

I cringe whenever I see someone start a sentence with "I'm thinking it could be....." . That's wrong because you're not thinking, you're guessing. I offered that analogy about working at the dealer, which mostly went over everyone's head, but that's the truth. You can't throw parts at something hoping to get lucky.

The OP, who seems like a nice person, has a bad problem with getting bogged down with trivial issues and avoiding doing the simple stuff. I started losing my patience because everything kept revolving around wiring and voltage drops, and yet not a single meaningful spark test had been performed to establish there was even an ignition problem. If he does a Hemi swap as he speculates doing, he'll think working on this Slant six is a walk in the park, and as prone to be distracted by random issues as he is I fear that'll be another project abandoned midstream.

Moral of the story is diagnose a no-start exactly as the damn FSM tells you to. Check for spark, check for fuel flow to the carb, then go from there. That doesn't mean you wouldn't have a wiring problem somewhere but work your way back to it. People that don't have a clue to begin with are only going to get even more confused when people start shouting ignition switch, bulkhead connector, fusible link. It's beyond me why you would start diagnosing a no-start at the ignition switch when you don't even know for sure there IS an electrical problem yet.

Again: The basic law of owning a Mopar. Carry a known good spare ECU, a known good spare ballast and the tools to replace them. Always.

To the OP...if you don't like the way the wiring harness works, go get one. Go get one. Don't talk and worry about it, go get one. There's always '75 Valiants and Darts always being parted here, somebody for sure has one.
 
64cudaV8 said:
Haha. If you guys go straight to wiring to solve problems please don't ever do this for a living. Wether the wiring looked f-d up or not. I never said replace the parts. I said check them out. You always, always go to components first. After making sure everything is getting correct power to them. Which would take all of 2 minutes. Helpful is stopping you from pulling you out of the mess you were in by tearing wiring out. I work on much more than 15 mil worth a crap and have for over 20 years. I actually work for Nasa now. I hope I know what I'm doing... This is assuming you know the part is good after you check it out. You can spend a couple of hours and fix the car the right way or spend a week shooting wires that are just fine.
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For the genius you OBVIOUSLY are,you apparently have e reading comprehension
problem,including the posts title.Also,GENIUS,you can explain how checking the volt
reading at a wire of 12 4V is good and yet the device still doesn't work.You've made
sure the ground is good,but nothing.OH,it's called current,and when you apply a
load to it,your 12V disappears and now nothing.In the case of ign. mods.,it need
only drop below 9V to render it inoperative,if you read the posts this was the case
Poor wiring condition and repairs should always be CHECKED and repaired when
they are visually apparent. You seem to be working harder at being an ***,
than actually helping the OP. And for all your hard work I say, job well done!:finga:
 
Hey killer6, then you have a bad battery dumbass. by the way it was a bad ecm.. and his battery was very low. You should not troubleshoot either. If you turn the ign switch on and the voltage drops to 9 then you might wanna put said meter on the battery and turn the switch again. See how simple that is. However if the car worked just fine then all the sudden wont start then very good chance its not wiring. I have worked with guys like you in the field. Key word is worked. While I was in the airforce they were reassigned to the tool crib before they f-up an aircraft. While here at nasa they just get fired. I now fix the components that are messed up. VHF radios, tcas systems, Flight displays down to simple landing lights. This is after I worked flight line as a box swapper. Which 9 times out of 10 is not wiring. Its the component. The planes I work on our older than these cars. Some much older. Get a clue and stick to whatever it is you do instead of giving troubleshooting advice.
 
TylerW said:
LOL well an fsm WOULD help, but you have to use what's called critical thinking when working on cars.

I cringe whenever I see someone start a sentence with "I'm thinking it could be....." . That's wrong because you're not thinking, you're guessing. I offered that analogy about working at the dealer, which mostly went over everyone's head, but that's the truth. You can't throw parts at something hoping to get lucky.

The OP, who seems like a nice person, has a bad problem with getting bogged down with trivial issues and avoiding doing the simple stuff. I started losing my patience because everything kept revolving around wiring and voltage drops, and yet not a single meaningful spark test had been performed to establish there was even an ignition problem. If he does a Hemi swap as he speculates doing, he'll think working on this Slant six is a walk in the park, and as prone to be distracted by random issues as he is I fear that'll be another project abandoned midstream.

Moral of the story is diagnose a no-start exactly as the damn FSM tells you to. Check for spark, check for fuel flow to the carb, then go from there. That doesn't mean you wouldn't have a wiring problem somewhere but work your way back to it. People that don't have a clue to begin with are only going to get even more confused when people start shouting ignition switch, bulkhead connector, fusible link. It's beyond me why you would start diagnosing a no-start at the ignition switch when you don't even know for sure there IS an electrical problem yet.

Again: The basic law of owning a Mopar. Carry a known good spare ECU, a known good spare ballast and the tools to replace them. Always.

To the OP...if you don't like the way the wiring harness works, go get one. Go get one. Don't talk and worry about it, go get one. There's always '75 Valiants and Darts always being parted here, somebody for sure has one.
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Exactly!! :cheers:
 
Well, maybe you and tyler can talk about the factory service manuals, but apparently
you can't read them.If tester C-4166 or C-4166A and adapter C-4166-1 aren't
available,but I'm sure most of us have those,then the following procedure is to be
used.Check For voltage within 1V of batt. voltage with the ign. mod. disconnected
and the key in run at mod. terms. #1 & #2,ign. supply & coil neg. return to mod.
If it is not within 1V of batt.V figures#10 & #11 show which circuits need checked
and repaired.That means the wiring,and that is the FIRST step in the FSM,
genius.Also, a voltage disappearing when a load is applied to a wire that is bad,
or has a bad connection or termination.Just like the one on the battery that needs
cleaned or replaced when you hit the key and everything that was lit up goes dead
Genius.I believe I stated the multiple fail for a reason,the OP had them,bad batt.
condition,poor wiring(which he arrived at basically per theFSM),and a defective
aftermarket ign. mod. I've worked w/people like you too, usually they are asked
to leave because the customers can't afford to pay for new parts they didn't need
only to pay for a"major harness repair" on top of it afterwards. Most elec.s are
not returnable,...in the real world.
 
Killer6 said:
Well, maybe you and tyler can talk about the factory service manuals, but apparently
you can't read them.If tester C-4166 or C-4166A and adapter C-4166-1 aren't
available,but I'm sure most of us have those,then the following procedure is to be
used.Check For voltage within 1V of batt. voltage with the ign. mod. disconnected
and the key in run at mod. terms. #1 & #2,ign. supply & coil neg. return to mod.
If it is not within 1V of batt.V figures#10 & #11 show which circuits need checked
and repaired.That means the wiring,and that is the FIRST step in the FSM,
genius.Also, a voltage disappearing when a load is applied to a wire that is bad,
or has a bad connection or termination.Just like the one on the battery that needs
cleaned or replaced when you hit the key and everything that was lit up goes dead
Genius.I believe I stated the multiple fail for a reason,the OP had them,bad batt.
condition,poor wiring(which he arrived at basically per theFSM),and a defective
aftermarket ign. mod. I've worked w/people like you too, usually they are asked
to leave because the customers can't afford to pay for new parts they didn't need
only to pay for a"major harness repair" on top of it afterwards. Most elec.s are
not returnable,...in the real world.
Click to expand...


I would still like you to point out where I told him to go buy new parts? You are saying that not me Genius. HAHA This cuda I have now and 3 cars before it I have totally rewired with a new harness. ( not made or the car) I have built more complex equipment than your little car manual could ever dream of. Like was said. stay out of the advise giving for electrical problems. :tool:
 
Um, if the OP didn't have a known good"component" laying around,and that's where
YOU start,then he would have to purchase one now wouldn't he?As far as MY advice
goes,it was spot on.The first test I suggested eliminates the run ign. power supply,
ign. sw.,ballast,& coil as culprits all at once in about a minute.The rest is just as
basic and quick as well,all tests actually could be done(preferably) from the mod.
connector.the 1st from term.#2. There are only 4 wires to check(5 w/dual ballast
and green/red wire),so i'm not sure who had the OP"shooting wires all over the
place",but that shouldn't take long even to check all of them.
It's Chrysler's"little car manual",and I was simply quoting it since it was brought
up. I don't use it for these simple old cars,but it is still usefull for the usual specs
etc.,and of course wiring diagrams.Have a nice day genius.
 
Whatever expert. Looks like your the one who cant read. Im sick of repeating myself. Hope the next guy isn't jerked around by you showing your awesome troubleshooting skills.:cya:


Killer6 said:
Um, if the OP didn't have a known good"component" laying around,and that's where
YOU start,then he would have to purchase one now wouldn't he?As far as MY advice
goes,it was spot on.The first test I suggested eliminates the run ign. power supply,
ign. sw.,ballast,& coil as culprits all at once in about a minute.The rest is just as
basic and quick as well,all tests actually could be done(preferably) from the mod.
connector.the 1st from term.#2. There are only 4 wires to check(5 w/dual ballast
and green/red wire),so i'm not sure who had the OP"shooting wires all over the
place",but that shouldn't take long even to check all of them.
It's Chrysler's"little car manual",and I was simply quoting it since it was brought
up. I don't use it for these simple old cars,but it is still usefull for the usual specs
etc.,and of course wiring diagrams.Have a nice day genius.
Click to expand...
 
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