Port my own heads?

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Cudapete

Cudapete

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So I'm no where near ready to do this, However thought I'd research now while in the body work stage. I have a 408 stroker for my dart that is 10:1 KB forged pistons, scat rods edelbrock heads (right out of the box) with a set of comp roller rockers and a comp cam .545 int/.545 exh &241 int/ 247 exh duration @.050 110 degree lobe sep.(Its one of those blueprint motors if you have seen my other posts on the issues I had with it breaking up over the summer.)Its backed by a 727 built by Coan with a 10" coan 3500 conveter and 3.55 gears. The car went 12.33 @106 with issues and crap slicks, my goal is 11.99 @110ish, With that said my questions are I'd like to go with a bigger cam (I think) If you agree what do you recommend? also I've picked up a M-1 single plane manifold and plan on porting both the intake and the heads. I've ported several sets of cast heads at home and with the price for a pro to do them I'm considering doing these my self. Now I know I wont be able to do a pro cnc job, but I'm figuring every little bit helps, What do you guys recommend and if I do them are there any particular tricks or concerns with edelbrock heads to watch for when I do them? Any help would be appreciated thanks PETE
 
Cudapete said:
So I'm no where near ready to do this, However thought I'd research now while in the body work stage. I have a 408 stroker for my dart that is 10:1 KB forged pistons, scat rods edelbrock heads (right out of the box) with a set of comp roller rockers and a comp cam .545 int/.545 exh &241 int/ 247 exh duration @.050 110 degree lobe sep.(Its one of those blueprint motors if you have seen my other posts on the issues I had with it breaking up over the summer.)Its backed by a 727 built by Coan with a 10" coan 3500 conveter and 3.55 gears. The car went 12.33 @106 with issues and crap slicks, my goal is 11.99 @110ish, With that said my questions are I'd like to go with a bigger cam (I think) If you agree what do you recommend? also I've picked up a M-1 single plane manifold and plan on porting both the intake and the heads. I've ported several sets of cast heads at home and with the price for a pro to do them I'm considering doing these my self. Now I know I wont be able to do a pro cnc job, but I'm figuring every little bit helps, What do you guys recommend and if I do them are there any particular tricks or concerns with edelbrock heads to watch for when I do them? Any help would be appreciated thanks PETE
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Porting eddy heads is kinda tricky...but in this case you can expect with some cleanup, good valve job and opening up the pushrod pinch to add around 15-20HP to your engine.
First have a really good valvejob done to the heads. Preferably by someone who's done these heads.
Then open up the pushrod pinch but be carefull not to break through into the pushrod hole because then you'll either have to fix it yourself or pay someone to fix it.
At the time of having the vj done, have them backcut the intake valve with a 30°.
You can also slim down the wall at the head bolt bulge by .080 and that will help.
 
Leave it to a pro.........heads are too expensive for a home jobby in this case. IMHO
 
If it was up to me?? I would change the gear to something like a 4:10 and get some good QTP's and 11's shouldnt be a problem.
 
Been thinking about setting up another center section with some 3.91's or 4.10's and planning on getting some brand new slicks eventually too. The reason I am interested in putting the single plane on with the porting and possibly changing the cam is this motor is done at 5800 and I'd like to get a little more rpm out of it and gain a little more hp and tq while i'm at it. Comp cams recommended .564 int/.564 295 int/307 exh 106 centerline with ported heads and an M-1. Is this worth the work to swap cams and the expense and or time to port or am I really just gears and tires away from my goal? Thanks for the advice so far guys.
 
I'd think with the combo they sent you you'd be there already? Sounds like tuning is needed, the MPH seems low for the Cam/Compression and such.

I run a Smaller Hyd Crane 302 cam with Iron heads and 3.23's in a portly 3700+lb Ebody to 109mph traps and a cheap 2500 stall verter with a SB stroker.

Tom

I'd figure out the breaking up issue, maybe ignition or fuel related? You should be there with some to spare.
 
72challorange said:
I'd think with the combo they sent you you'd be there already? Sounds like tuning is needed, the MPH seems low for the Cam/Compression and such.

I run a Smaller Hyd Crane 302 cam with Iron heads and 3.23's in a portly 3700+lb Ebody to 109mph traps and a cheap 2500 stall verter with a SB stroker.

Tom

I'd figure out the breaking up issue, maybe ignition or fuel related? You should be there with some to spare.
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First off thanks to all for the advice and I'm certainly not trying to argue with any ones answer but am just asking some more questions because I have the motor out and would like to get the most out of it. I dont want to regret not doing as much as i can and having to pull it again to do these things (at least not for a long while)
Tom your right and when I went to the track I had a major ignition issue and the wrong jets in the carb, thats all been corrected since then. As far as the mph being low, truth be told it was my first time with slicks and had a hard time with the rear end being "loose " and kept letting off near the end of the track plus it breaking up terribly on the big end Gave me some pretty poor times and mph's. Have'nt been back to the track since fixing issues ,also want to get some better slicks too. The car is totally stripped for a repaint so I thought i'd do some changes before putting it back in. The info I've recieved so far makes good sense. But let me ask this: what do you think about just a gasket match of the heads and intake, the addition of the M-1 since I already bought it, Maybe some 3.91's and basically leave everything else the same? Cant hurt right? and the single plane manifold wiill give a little more on the top end? I always thought there was enough the way it is to go 11.99 but since its out I figured why not. Thanks
 
Was it feeling squirley? When I didn't have enough air in my slicks my car felt loose.
 
Yeah it felt like the car was swaying back and forth a lot! I kept feeling like I was gonna lose it and smash the wall. The slicks we're m/t ET drags, that were 14" 28 x 9's I was running 15 lbs in them if I remember right. They were really whipped though I borrowed them from a friend just to see how it would do. I dont know if being trashed had anything to do with the loose feeling the track I test and tune at isnt the greatest either, But its the closest to home.
 
Well if you can stay in it, I'd bet the ET and MPH's would be where you want them. A little gasket matching shouldn't hurt I'd think. Make sure you won't run out of Revs with the new gear on the top end and You should be good to go if you can run it out.IMO

Tom
 
As it stands now I think I 'm gonna go with the M-1 with some mild porting and keep the 3.55's and take it back to the track with some good slicks and really hammer it and see how it goes. A little off the subject but this came up in a conversation not too long ago. Every small block I 've takin apart has always had a small plastic like gasket between the oil pump and block, Where can you get new ones of these? and what is the proper torque for the oil pump, also should there be a dab of loc tite on the bolts. thanks pete
 
Cudapete said:
As it stands now I think I 'm gonna go with the M-1 with some mild porting and keep the 3.55's and take it back to the track with some good slicks and really hammer it and see how it goes. A little off the subject but this came up in a conversation not too long ago. Every small block I 've takin apart has always had a small plastic like gasket between the oil pump and block, Where can you get new ones of these? and what is the proper torque for the oil pump, also should there be a dab of loc tite on the bolts. thanks pete
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Don't use the gasket between the oil pump and cap!! If it breaks you'll lose a ton of pressure!
 
This is just my opinion. The edelbrock heads are whats holding you back, I would port them. Its really not that hard to port heads, just dont be afraid. If you take them apart and clean them you will see an area right away where it should be obvious that there is port restriction, that will be the bowl area at the valve seat. After you port that area it will be painfully obvious where to go next, the guide boss. After that the head bolt pinch just up the port from there and then the port opening itself. I just ported my first Edelbrocks and they picked up 50 cfm plus on the intake side. So that has the potential for 100 additional hp. The vave job is an area that I didnt think there would be any improvement but my machine shop was able to get another 15 cfm from them with just a seat grinding. The pushrod pinch area is sensitive so you will need to sneak up on them. I will take pics of my Eddys today and post them for you to see and compare. I know that you are close to your goal but why not free up some free hp? I think the cam your running is a good cam and I would run the same cam to save money and if your not happy then change it later. I would spend the money on sorting out the other problems you have. Good luck and you can do it!
 
What's the 60' time.

ET is primarily a chassis/tire/converter deal.

I'm guessing the MPH on the car isn't where it should be. Probably should be above 110 even with the crappy tire. Make sure the fuel system is up to the task.

You wouldn't happen to have a MSD6AL and a 6000 chip in it would you?
 
Brian, no sweat on the gasket I was just wondering the reason for it ,I've never used one cause i could never find a place to get a new one and they never come in a gasket kit yet always there when I've torn an small block down, however I am still curious what the actual torque spec of the pump is and is a dab of blue loc tite ok on the bolts?

Turbo dart thanks for the advice on the heads I would really appreciate some pics of your work.

Cracked back Here is a better list of whats done to the car as it is right now:
408 stroker 10:1 KB forged pistons, scat rods edelbrock heads (right out of the box) with a set of comp roller rockers and a comp cam .545 int/.545 exh &241 int/ 247 exh duration @.050 110 degree lobe sep, edelbrock air gap dual plane manifold, Hooker super comp headers (1 5/8) into 2 1/2 tti exhaust, holley 4150 series carb 750 cfm, stock tank with 1/2" fuel line front to back and a holley elctric fuel pump ,Summit digital box with limiter set to 6450. Its backed by a 727 built by Coan with a manual reverse valve body, 10" coan 3500 conveter 3.55 gears and frame connectors from mancinis. I plan on running 28x9 14" M/T slicks again. since going to the track I got the cars breaking up issues straightened out. The mph was'nt the slicks not hooking or anything it was just the way the car felt on the track was weird to me so I kept letting up mid track or so plus it was breaking up @ 5000. Unfortuneatly never got back to the track after fixing the issues but for what its worth It went 12.66 @ 106 with a 1.80 60 ft time (I found my time slips finally I was wrong in the beginning of this post sorry bout that. this is what is on the slip) pete
 
You should be in the high 11's already with slicks on it,I have preaty much the same combo, edy magnum heads OOTB,244/252 comp solid 520/540 on a 110,mech fuel pump with a 800 edy thunder series carb,3.55 gears 3500ish stall in a 904 with manual VB.First time at the track it went 12.4 at 114 with regualr street tires ,with slicks it runs high 11's ,ohh same intake too edel air gap.It weighs 3250 with me in it.73 duster.
 
I think theres 2 things holding your motor back. Small headers and exhaust. If you cant afford bigger headers,I would try and put a 3" exhaust on it. Ive seen cars pick up 3 tenths going from 2 1/2" to 3" exhaust.
Im NO expert,just my little experience and opinion.
 
Yeah I am aware of the small tube header issue, several people told me to go 1 7/8 " which I probably am gonna do at some point just so far the a good set are like $700! The hookers and the TTI exhaust were new when I got the car so I reused them. Anybody know where I can get a decent set of 1 7/8 for maybe half or a little more they dont have to be ceramic coated.

From what I 'm hearing about my set up I need to get back to the track, do some more tuning and really ring this things neck! Man I wish it was together and not December!
 
So got a few old questions still unanswered and a new one
1) Anybody know where I can get a decent set of 1" 7/8 headers for maybe $500 or a little less? they dont have to be ceramic coated.

2) What is the proper torque for a small block oil pump and is a dab of blue loc tite on the threads ok.

3)Can I get some pics of some of the port jobs you guys have done.

And my new question is regarding the M-1. I 've been told that the M-1 needs major blending right under the carb where it goes into the runners supposedly not as clean a transition as the edelbrock victor, is this true and if so does anybody have pics of how they ported it. Thanks
 
Here are the pics of my Edelbrocks. Remember I am just some backyard mechanic guy who started porting my heads when I was out of work. Here are the results. These are just a quick clean up and are the fifth set of heads that I have done. The other heads are 2 small blocks ,x's and j's, and 2 big block , 906 and 915s. The other small blocks made good power, 450 and 500 hp as well as the big blocks both made just over 600hp. These Edelbrocks flowed 255 cfm at .700 lift and started at 215cfm at .600 lift. I know Edelbrock says that they flow 250 out of the box but thats not true. When I called Edelbrocks tech line their explanation that there are discrepances between benches and they allow a 10% difference. I am not really impressed with the Edelbrock RPMs. Regardless I think that 40 cfm will wake up your big inch small block. I see that Shady Dell gets something in the neighborhood of 290 cfm out of them and he is a real pro when it comes to small blocks and I am going to use him for my w-5 small block.

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Just as a side note, I have a 70 swinger with a 360 in it. Here is some background on it. 367 c.i. stock crank, rods, block. 11.11 to 1 compression JE pistons. Ported X heads by me with 2.02 1.60 valves. A solid flat tappet .540 lift 255 @ .050. Torker intake with a 750 dp holley, 1 5/8 headers 2.5 inch mandrel exhaust dumps at the rear axle. 904 low gear with 4.56 rear gear. My car was just like g-ma had it, with PS and column shift, steel wheels, and all steel. It weighed 3240 with me in it. It went a best of 11.68 at 116mph. I tried bigger TTI step headers and 3 inch exhaust and it did not run any faster even after exhaustive tuning. I also tried an 850 before and after the exhaust work with no gain. My point is at this level the exhaust and carb were right. Once you complete the head work your motor should make more power than mine and may react differently to exhaust. Every combo reacts different to different things. Good luck and dont be afraid to try new things.
 
Fully ported with no welding or epoxy on my bench I usually hit 297-299 at .700 and 230's on exhaust.
I've flowed some other "pro ported" heads that were supposed to go 300+ and never got to 290!!

These heads are hard to port though unless you've done them before. It's hard to manage air speed in them once you get everything "correct"!
 
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