"POWER NATION" slant six build

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Bill Dedman said:
Point of information:

The Wallace online calculator, which is the only such online drag racing source for performance figures arrived at by entering weight and horsepower numbers I know of, says a 3,170-pound vehicle (that's a 3,000-pound A Body plus a driver weight of an NHRA-mandated 170 pounds,) with 250 horsepower should turn in a quarter mile performance of 13.58 at 98.52 mph.

That's their opinion, not necessarily mine, but it's all I have to go on.
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Fair enough. My Virtual Engine Calculator only gave a 14.28@94 for the same combo. Differences in calculators I suppose.
 
Did anyone catch the follow up episode? Lol,that pathetic build made nearly 140 h.p.. They did lots of extra work to the Duster,brakes,rebuilt 904,rebuit the front suspension and rear,better gear ration in the diff. But holy hell,that first episode,the pistons in the slant were WAAAAY down the hole. CR must be barely 8:1...
 
needsaresto said:
Did anyone catch the follow up episode? Lol,that pathetic build made nearly 140 h.p.. They did lots of extra work to the Duster,brakes,rebuilt 904,rebuit the front suspension and rear,better gear ration in the diff. But holy hell,that first episode,the pistons in the slant were WAAAAY down the hole. CR must be barely 8:1...
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From what I h ear about these people, I don't think I WANT them doing a boosted slant.... they would probably blow it up...:eek:ops:
 
Yeah, saw the 1-18-2015 episode. Made almost twice the power, 70 to what, 132? Nice clean Duster, minus the headliner, but they could of done more. On the other show, Detroit Muscle, they did a Hemi based on the b block, all aluminum, saved an inch in height. Yeah I watched it, only cause it wasn't chevy. I like chevy, just not all the time. Every week gets to be too much.
 
Brandon Weaver said:
Fair enough. My Virtual Engine Calculator only gave a 14.28@94 for the same combo. Differences in calculators I suppose.
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Maybe one is flywheel HP and the other is rwhp...

But regardless, even at 14.2 seconds, the car would be a good race for a (stock) 340 Duster.... They ran 14.30s, as I remember.

That performance is a far cry from an 18-second, stock slant six, A body.

Worth doing, I think.:violent1:

Ask Serj or Rusty Plymouth how they like theirs...:glasses7:
 
Honestly Bill,you are correct. It's embarassing enough when your the host of a tv show called engine power,and pull off a brain fart like this slant fiasco.
 
Bill Dedman said:
Maybe one is flywheel HP and the other is rwhp...

But regardless, even at 14.2 seconds, the car would be a good race for a (stock) 340 Duster.... They ran 14.30s, as I remember.

That performance is a far cry from an 18-second, stock slant six, A body.

Worth doing, I think.:violent1:

Ask Serj or Rusty Plymouth how they like theirs...:glasses7:
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18 seconds? being a bit gracious dont you think? lol. my old 72 valiant would run a 19.99-20.00 all day. would have been a great bracket car if i was into that kinda thing at the time. my 66 started at 18's but i had already done exhaust and had a 390 holley on it. current setup minus the hair dryer was 17.7, with the turbo im looking to get into the 12's maybe even the 11's if the motor holds that much boost with the stock internals. either way im addicted. freakin thing hauls a$$. ive rode in big block cars that dont pull as hard.
 
Strangest thing in the Duster episode was that they kept gaining significant torque & HP as they increased the spark advance, then they stopped, and far short of what I think many here run (~15 deg total, I recall). Was the host trying to not embarass himself after calling it "a leaning tower of not much power" in the 1st episode? The engine sounded amazing.
 
I watched the episodes. A few notes - that was a bone stock rebuild with a cam and valve springs. They could have used their own "tricks" and had the head milled, used a thinner MLS gasket, done performance work on the head, etc, but they didn't. They did only RWP - they couldn't mate the slant to their dyno. Then they stopped tesing at 6° BTDC when previous tests picked up power each time. I think they could have found another 10-15hp by tuning the carb and running more advance but they didn't seem to bother. It was something different but you can tell that came from the director's office - not the guys. They didn't want to do it.
 
Chevy guys just don't understand the tuning aspects of the Mighty Slant. You can't use small block chevy thinking when dealing with a Slant.
 
moper said:
I watched the episodes. A few notes - that was a bone stock rebuild with a cam and valve springs. They could have used their own "tricks" and had the head milled, used a thinner MLS gasket, done performance work on the head, etc, but they didn't. They did only RWP - they couldn't mate the slant to their dyno. Then they stopped tesing at 6° BTDC when previous tests picked up power each time. I think they could have found another 10-15hp by tuning the carb and running more advance but they didn't seem to bother. It was something different but you can tell that came from the director's office - not the guys. They didn't want to do it.
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Was it turbocharged? Supercharged, or fed NOS?

No?

Why not?

That is the ONLY way to get significant power out of a slant six....

These guys make their living doing this...
How can they completely MISS the ONLY way to get significant power out of this engine???

Idiots...:violent1:
 
just maybe these "tenneesee Hollywood" TV car show guys, just maybe they would have NO desire to build and dyno a turbo slant!?????? ever think of that!??? LOL do they really have a desire to show the slants real potential??? NOW if some co. built a bolt on turbo setup for the slant...... then maybe????????
 
I believe the SuperCharger Store has a bolt on set up for the Slant. Maybe?
 
How about we send them some hate mail explaining how dumb they are?
 
Well, it makes sense now, after seeing Part 2. The owner just wanted a nice reliable driver, and that's exactly what he got.
 
Bill Dedman said:
Was it turbocharged? Supercharged, or fed NOS?

No?

Why not?

That is the ONLY way to get significant power out of a slant six....

These guys make their living doing this...
How can they completely MISS the ONLY way to get significant power out of this engine???

Idiots...:violent1:
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I tell you what, for being a 'slant' guy, you have talked trash on that motor more than any other Mopar guy I've ever seen. Has it ever occurred to you that the people making 'only' 300 horse have successfully increased their power by more than double? Please, find me someone who has a 250+ horse slant and doesn't absolutely love it. Now that I'm aware of what 'significant' power is, I'll inform guys with 550 horse 340s that they ain't got squat.

just maybe these "tenneesee Hollywood" TV car show guys, just maybe they would have NO desire to build and dyno a turbo slant!?????? ever think of that!??? LOL do they really have a desire to show the slants real potential??? NOW if some co. built a bolt on turbo setup for the slant...... then maybe????????
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That's my bet. They build n/a Chebby and Furd v8's. The slant was a step out of the box anyways, why take a running leap in the direction against what you've had success with? Yeah, they may be bumbling idiots, but they get the views doing what they do. I'd hate to know the price of a legitimate bolt on turbo kit for a slant.

I believe the SuperCharger Store has a bolt on set up for the Slant. Maybe?
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I believe you're correct. I also believe it's somewhere in the ballpark of 5k. It ain't a real popular kit that I know of, and I can see why.
 
moper said:
I watched the episodes. A few notes - that was a bone stock rebuild with a cam and valve springs. They could have used their own "tricks" and had the head milled, used a thinner MLS gasket, done performance work on the head, etc, but they didn't. They did only RWP - they couldn't mate the slant to their dyno. Then they stopped tesing at 6° BTDC when previous tests picked up power each time. I think they could have found another 10-15hp by tuning the carb and running more advance but they didn't seem to bother. It was something different but you can tell that came from the director's office - not the guys. They didn't want to do it.
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I scratched my head at that one. It's making huge gains in power feeding it timing and out of the blue they stop??? WTF!!! I do the same thing on the dyno, choose an indiscriminate point to just stop, cause that's good enough. LOL

Those guys, especially the main black haired knuckle, wouldn't know how to time an engine throughout the range if you gave them a roadmap.
 
There's lots of slant turbo bolt on kits. They're just all only for ourselves. There's several brands, the Pishta, Dedman, Rusty, Serj, and every other brand I can't think of right now. There's just only one of each kit. Special editions you see. 1 of 1. Each one is also numbered with a serial number that looks like a scratch, but is actually a "1"
 
brandon weaver said:
i tell you what, for being a 'slant' guy, you have talked trash on that motor more than any other mopar guy i've ever seen. Has it ever occurred to you that the people making 'only' 300 horse have successfully increased their power by more than double? Please, find me someone who has a 250+ horse slant and doesn't absolutely love it. Now that i'm aware of what 'significant' power is, i'll inform guys with 550 horse 340s that they ain't got squat.

I don't know what you're referring to when you say, "you have talked trash on that motor more than any other mopar guy i've ever seen."
If "talking trash" to you, is saying things of a critical nature, then I may be guilty, because as the saying goes, "you can't make an omlet without breaking a few eggs." if my pointing out the slant six's Achilles Heel, a performance-killing "feature" that prevents it from ever making good power naturally-aspirated, then i am guilty. Everybody who attempts to "massage" one of these engines for better power output, really needs to realize that the cylinder head, a totally irreplaceable part since no one has ever produced any other heads (except for a few hard-to-access Argentinan $$$$$ examples,) which breathe well enough to make much over 300 hp, n/a.

It is a big job, and costs a significant amount of money to buy and install all the necessary parts to build a fully-modified slant six without some form of power adder.

The problem is, as I have said, the fact that the head was originally designed for the 170 motor, and was never upgraded with regards to flow-capability... EVER. So, we are stuck with (225cid,) a motor with 39 cubic inch cylinders with tiny valves and ports, and a breathing capability to match. The small-block Chevy V-8 (1967-'68 z-28 302cid) is a case in point; it also has 39 cubic inches per cylinder, but with much larger 2.02"/1.6" diameter valves, vs. Our 1.625" intake and 1.355" exhaust (which can effectively, be enlarged to 1.7" and 1.5"...) are better, but nowhere near the breathing capability of the brand-x. The 302 chevys that are ported show flow nearing 280cfm on the intakes, whereas our "leaning tower of power" ported heads might muster 220... See the problem?

If you can be happy with the kind of reduced expectations (250-275hp) that that "strangulated" flow results in, then a naturally aspirated slant six will probably work okay for you, and you can avoid the extra expense and time (and, education,) required to achieve the significantly higher numbers afforded by a forced induction setup...

Or, you can use the stock engine, stock reciprocating assembly, at least, never pull the head, and bolt on a low-boost (10psi?) turbo setup, and maybe spend even less money than a naturally-aspirated engine for the same output (275hp?)

You pays your money, and you takes your choice... But, you need to know the whys and wherefores, going in... So, you can make an informed decision.

So much for the trash talk...


i'd hate to know the price of a legitimate bolt on turbo kit for a slant.

might be expensive... Might not; I would think it might depend on the projected output; 300 or 500 hp... Lots of expensive parts for the high-horsepower motor (arp studs, forged internals, etc...)

But, the slant six with forced induction needs some "ink"..... Its potential is unknown to 99% of the guys who might build one, if they knew.


Power nation has the ethical responsibility to educate its viewership on that issue... And, they make their living doing that sort of thing, so, why should they not???

I can't see any legitimate reason...


..
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xx
 
the old saying : "follow the money trail"??? car mags makes their money from advertisers NOT sellng mags!??? probably same way with the show????? advertisers make it all work........rating rule... ratings are coming from the largest mass, which ain't mopar!??? LOL
I agree, we would like the think the show should have some sort of obligation to be fair to all makes, , but if we tell them that,, they would probably laugh at us!????
at least Ma Mopar's old iron is respected nowdays. I remember when the brand X and Y guys laughed at us mopar " musclecar" guys!???
 
I was glad to see a Mopar on this show and the best thing about this imo was the guy who had the car. Liked how he said when he met his wife, she had the blonde hair and the car, he knew he was in trouble. (or something like that). Liked the old school pic they showed of them too. He said he didn't know who she loved more, him or the car, boy that's a reversal of what I'm used to hearing LOL
 
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