Purolator & Wix will not warranty standpipe oil filters for /6 but Baldwin will.

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csheehy

csheehy

^Yup, that's me
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Just heads up - I had the following exchange today with Mann+Hummel (below) who owns Mann, Purolator, and Wix brand filters. I was looking for their best filter for my slant that had a standpipe - since I'm not using an oil pump that has the standpipe attached.

In short, Mann (Wix & Purolator) will not warranty any filter on our engines that have a standpipe - like the Wix #51806 or Purolator #L30137 that many of us use. If they don't warranty it on my engine, that's enough for me to not buy it.

So, I contacted Baldwin, and they recommend and warranty the BT216 filter, which have both a standpipe and an anti-drainback valve. I've been using their B2 filters for years, good stuff.

3. (final) REPLY: Not for that car we don’t. Baldwin BT216 crosses to 51806, it has a standpipe. We will not warranty it or stand behind its use on your Plymouth Barracuda
2. ME: Between Mann, Wix, and Purolator - you don't have a filter with a standpipe that fits the slant-6 engine (comprable to Baldwin BT216)?
1. (initial) REPLY: 1968 Plymouth Barracuda 3.7L 225 CID = WIX 51515. This filter does not have a stand pipe and is not offered that way. It does have an anti-drain back valve.​

So... take from this dialogue what you will, but I'm ordering some Baldwin's.
 
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Someone over at slantsix.org questioned the validity of anyone submitting a warranty claim for a failed oil filter. Solid point indeed!

Here's my response...

"Yup - I owned an insurance adjusting company years ago and recall several mechanical failure claims where oil filters failed (seal blew or case split). It doesn't seem common but happens.​

So, to me, the fact that a manufacturer will not warranty a product for a particular application, even when the part physically fits - is good enough for me to not buy it. But that's me... your experience may differ :)"​
 
A filter may fit, but if the manufacturer doesn't include it in their current catalog for a certain application, they won't likely warranty it. Even if it fails due to manufacturing defect, they may deny a claim because of mis-application. In the case of an engine that hasn't been produced in 30 years and may have issues with a certain filter, just not listing an application is the safe way out.

Filter companies know they will have at-fault failures, and build the cost of them into the price of the product. This is M+H's way of reducing liability. Good thing there is an alternative. Baldwin's are a very good filter.
 
I'm confused...........are these non-warranty filters included in say, Wix listings for slants, or is this a filter that's not shown/ recommended for these engines?
 
Mann, Wix, and Purolator are all saying they do not have a filter with a standpipe that is recommended for the slant.

This is only a concern if, say, you change your oil pump and do not have a replacement standpipe on the new pump. I have an NOS oil pump which did not include the standpipe - so I'm only using oil filters that have that feature.

The standard filters that appear in their catalog are fine and are not being contested here. Before changing my oil pump, I used the standard Baldwin, Purolator, and Wix filters all the time - equal quality for my concern.

Hope that adds clarity...
 
csheehy said:
Mann, Wix, and Purolator are all saying they do not have a filter with a standpipe that is recommended for the slant.

This is only a concern if, say, you change your oil pump and do not have a replacement standpipe on the new pump. I have an NOS oil pump which did not include the standpipe - so I'm only using oil filters that have that feature.

The standard filters that appear in their catalog are fine and are not being contested here. Before changing my oil pump, I used the standard Baldwin, Purolator, and Wix filters all the time - equal quality for my concern.

Hope that adds clarity...
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I guess I don't blame them not wanting to put a guarantee on a filter not designed for your application.
 
wonder if Purolater would warranty mine? Its spec'd to a slant.....
s-l1600.jpg
 
Need adaptors to clock it at 7. That would be neat. I never ran a standpipe. Just cross drilled the cranks 'overkill' and hv pumps.
Bearings were like new at 150k

The idea of this occurrence causing harm, has anyone incured damage from this with proof it wasn't something else? I'd like to see some data. I'm open and interested if its supported.
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
The idea of this occurrence causing harm, has anyone incured damage from this with proof it wasn't something else? I'd like to see some data. I'm open and interested if its supported.
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The post is about oil filter types that have an integral standpipe - and which manufacturers back them for use on the slant-6. There is no contesting of the validity of the oil-pump-mounted standpipe going on here.
 
csheehy said:
The post is about oil filter types that have an integral standpipe - and which manufacturers back them for use on the slant-6. There is no contesting of the validity of the oil-pump-mounted standpipe going on here.
Click to expand...

It sounded like there was some importance to having a stand pipe. So this is more of a purist 'restoration' type of discussion.
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Need adaptors to clock it at 7. That would be neat. I never ran a standpipe. Just cross drilled the cranks 'overkill' and hv pumps.
Bearings were like new at 150k

The idea of this occurrence causing harm, has anyone incured damage from this with proof it wasn't something else? I'd like to see some data. I'm open and interested if its supported.
Click to expand...

This is what I did with mine. Serves a dual purpose. Lays the filter down so there's no drain back and allows room for that Motorcraft 2 quart filter.
DSCF1542.JPG

....and worrying about warranty on an oil filter? I find that absolutely hilarious. That's why you have an oil gauge or light. Pay attantion to your gauges. lol
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
It sounded like there was some importance to having a stand pipe. So this is more of a purist 'restoration' type of discussion.
Click to expand...

Yet, even Chrysler saw fit to exclude the standpipe on the later models.
 
Fair points on all sides in this discussion. I'm not about to criticise anyone's decision on whether to worry about filter warranties—they might or might not be the same decisions I'd make; everyone has to decide for themself what they're comfortable doing, and there's no right or wrong answer here. It shows just how rational and consistent we humans aren't that we're perfectly happy to drive an old car, severely unsafe by today's standards…but too risk-averse to use a heavy-duty filter because the maker won't warrant it in an off-label application.

We also see rabbits in clouds, a face in the moon, Jesus in our grilled-cheese sandwiches from time to time, and luck in our favourite numbers. None of it's really there, but…MonkeyOS 1.1b3 is a very quirky operating system!
drive.gif


Back to oil filters: I happily included Baldwin filters on my yes-list for years. The happiness faded when they started arriving labelled "MADE IN CHINA". I shrugged and sighed and picked another brand. That was enough years ago that any number of changes could've happened since then; I have no idea where Baldwin filters are made now.
 
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RustyRatRod said:
Yet, even Chrysler saw fit to exclude the standpipe on the later models.
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No, they didn't; see here.

Here y'go: 1962 TSB referring to the new standpipe with check valve replacing the previous no-valve standpipe and the no-standpipe adapter before that; '60-'63 A-body FPC showing all three parts, and the '86-'87 Dodge Truck FPC (last one to contain Slant-6 engine components) showing the standpipe with check valve.

D-62-79.jpg


10-4-QRST-FPC.jpg


Pages from 86-87 Dodge Truck FPC.jpg
 
slantsixdan said:
No, they didn't; see here.

Fair points on all sides in this discussion. I'm not about to criticise anyone's decision on whether to worry about filter warranties—they might or might not be the same decisions I'd make; everyone has to decide for themself what they're comfortable doing, and there's no right or wrong answer here. It shows just how rational and consistent we humans aren't that we're perfectly happy to drive an old car, severely unsafe by today's standards…but too risk-averse to use a heavy-duty filter because the maker won't warrant it in an off-label application.

We also see rabbits in clouds, a face in the moon, Jesus in our grilled-cheese sandwiches from time to time, and luck in our favourite numbers. None of it's really there, but…MonkeyOS 1.1b3 is a very quirky operating system! View attachment 1715770887
Click to expand...

Thanks for settin me straight Dan....as usual. In that linked to post you left out an option. This one:

OR you can use a 90* filter adapter like this:
NO chance of oil drain back. I also like that I have room to run a 2 quart filter.
DSCF1542.JPG
 
slantsixdan said:
No, they didn't; see here.

Here y'go: 1962 TSB referring to the new standpipe with check valve replacing the previous no-valve standpipe and the no-standpipe adapter before that; '60-'63 A-body FPC showing all three parts, and the '86-'87 Dodge Truck FPC (last one to contain Slant-6 engine components) showing the standpipe with check valve.

View attachment 1715770890

View attachment 1715770891

View attachment 1715770893
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...and I don't know why, but I THOUGHT I remembered you saying somewhere that Chrysler removed the standpipes at some point. Obviously, I remembered incorrectly. lol
 
RustyRatRod said:
OR you can use a 90* filter adapter like this
Click to expand...

Clever! I ran the 2-quart filter a time or two on my '62 Lancer, without any adapter. The fit was close, but the engine mounts were good, so it did fit. Neat trick, but I quit doing it because I didn't really see the point; it wasn't a race car so I didn't need the extra quart of oil volume, and a giant filter takes longer to fill up, so probably no practical benefit.

Another option: the RHD oil pump (with threaded fittings for inlet and outlet, and no filter mount pad) and a set of the '63-up Australian hard lines and bracket to put the filter at the left front corner of the block. Base-up for no drainback, out in the open for E-Z changes (there were variants to accommodate A/C and P/S)

Australian_SL6_1bbl_Engine.jpg


Or the South African setup: same RHD oil pump, but the filter mounted horizontally on a base welded to the top of the valve cover. Seems like it would be messy at filter change time, and smoky at subsequent startup. Also might make valve adjustments kind of a PITA.

zacudaengine-jpg.56809.jpg


As for what filters to buy…there are enough good brands on the market that this isn't really difficult. The Fleetguard (the filter division of Cummins, as in the diesel engines) filters are eye-poppingly heavy-duty in their construction, and they even make an ultra premium version of the 1-quart filter. It doesn't have a built-in standpipe, but that didn't bother me. First-glance pricing on it is accordingly high, but I used to have good luck doing a little more searching and buying them by the case. I used up my last one about the time I sold my '62 Lancer, so that worked out.
 
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slantsixdan said:
Clever! I ran the 2-quart filter a time or two on my '62 Lancer, without any adapter. The fit was close, but the engine mounts were good, so it did fit. Neat trick, but I quit doing it because I didn't really see the point; it wasn't a race car so I didn't need the extra quart of oil volume, and a giant filter takes longer to fill up, so probably no practical benefit.

Another option: the RHD oil pump (with threaded fittings for inlet and outlet, and no filter mount pad) and a set of the '63-up Australian hard lines and bracket to put the filter at the left front corner of the block. Base-up for no drainback, out in the open for E-Z changes (there were variants to accommodate A/C and P/S)

View attachment 1715770917

Or the South African setup: same RHD oil pump, but the filter mounted horizontally on a base welded to the top of the valve cover. Seems like it would be messy at filter change time, and smoky at subsequent startup. Also might make valve adjustments kind of a PITA.

View attachment 1715770920
Click to expand...

I like the RHD filter setup. That at least uses the side of the engine that's more accessible. I like the larger filters.....no reason really. I just always have. Personal preference. Especially since I laid it down on the side.....well the filter top actually points down a few degrees, so I'm sure it stays pretty full. It's not messy at all to change. Since it's on its side, it's already full before the engine starts.
 
Yeah, I'm liking that 90° filter adapter idea—as long as the adapter is well designed (minimal flow restriction) and well made (not going to fall apart).
 
slantsixdan said:
Yeah, I'm liking that 90° filter adapter idea—as long as the adapter is well designed (minimal flow restriction) and well made (not going to fall apart).
Click to expand...

It's a Ford Motorsport piece. The last thing it is is restrictive. lol
 
I head there are NO RHD oil pumps left. Ie. start collecting cores and start mixing and matching parts to get one to work. No rebuild rotors either. This was on a slantsix.org post. I thought a standpipe was for the cartridge filters, not the anti-drainback spin-ons they went to so they just took it out of the build with a spin on with an anti drain-back valve. But Dan's article still showed them in the 80's
 
pishta said:
I head there are NO RHD oil pumps left. Ie. start collecting cores and start mixing and matching parts to get one to work. No rebuild rotors either. This was on a slantsix.org post. I thought a standpipe was for the cartridge filters, not the anti-drainback spin-ons they went to so they just took it out of the build with a spin on with an anti drain-back valve. But Dan's article still showed them in the 80's
Click to expand...

I'm stupid. What's different about a RHD oil pump?
 
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