Slow, Driving Rustoration 1972 Dart

[dartnlo]

I remember saying a few pages back that I was going to do a quick crappy paint job on the vinyl top area to fix the rust and make it more presentable until I get around to putting a new vinyl top on it. Well I did it. A quick crappy paint job!

Truly though it is a major improvement for curb appeal. No more exposed weld joints, no more crappy multi colored roof. Well sort of.

I ordered some F3 and F7 rattle cans off of ebay drastically underestimating how many cans I needed and how poorly the paint covered. When I got the shipment I tested it out to see the colors. They both looked like F3 to me. Even after 3 test coats on a sample they looked identical and the color name for F7 had the word yellow in it. I sent the seller the pictures of the test coats. He said he would send me out a new F7 and make it a better coverage mix too.

It was better but I just didn't order enough cans. Even with the extra can to start with 3 cans wasn't enough. I should have shot the whole thing in black primer first instead of gray. The roof is especially stripey. I said it yesterday but I'll say it again, no more rattle cans for me except for small rust fixes.

So excuses aside, I'm pleased with the way the body work turned out. Definitely good enough for now and good enough for a vinyl top down the road. The rust is gone and metal protected as well which was the plan. It will also look better than it did from 25 feet away. I'll have to see it outside but I like this subtle 2-tone. I may end up doing more body work on the C-pillars later and doing a trunk stripe in F7. The artificial lighting and flashes really didn't capture the colors very well.

 

[dartnlo]

Definitely an improvement. Where is the best place to get those little plastic moulding clips that snap on to body studs?

 

[dartnlo]

I also heard my radio for the first time tonight. It turns out the speaker was shot.

 

[dartfreak75]

Dang buddy looking good I like it! Looks good enough you can hold off on a vinyl top for a while!
I'm still trying to decide if I want to put a vinyl top back on mine or not.

 

[Baptist_Ben]

That came up good man. Makes a heap of difference to the overall appearance!

 

[dartnlo]

Well I'm getting closer to completing stage 1 of this driving rustoration, which is - make it a reliable daily driver - in theory if not practice. Thing is I really don't do too much daily driving lol. I work from home 95% of the time for my "real" job. I only drive 2 miles round trip for my evening job as a chef line cook. I'll probably leave her locked in the garage during the winter and avoid more rain, snow and rust.

I've been driving it around town to assess the mechanical needs better. It's still having the occasional cold start problems fuel/air wise. It seems to get flooded fairly easily in the morning. Once it starts and I drive it though, it starts super quick with barely a flick of the key. The transmission will need attention sooner than later. It's leaking, it is cold blooded and slips like crazy till it's ran for a minute or so. I've never adjusted the carb (except for idle speed), points or timing since I met her. I thought the radio was broken, turned out the speaker was bad. Heater works great with the fan hot-wired to a toggle switch and adjusting the vent control manually. I need to lubricate the window regulators, especially the driver's window. So a few big things and lots of little things to get done for this stage.

This weekend I'm planning on doing some long overdue maintenance. I never changed the oil in Iowa when I bought it, I've never even looked at the spark plugs, the pertronix ignition is still in the box, and I have a filter kit and fluid for the trans. I'd like to get all of those things done this weekend, basically change all fluids and do a tune-up. I'm planning on taking a short trip (about 50 miles) to Wichita to see Bohemian Rhapsody on Sunday. I figure it would be cool to go in a car that likely saw the rise of Queen in the 70s. So I hope to have her running even better than she is right now.

I have a dual speaker bracket ordered from FABO member 74-sport.399 and a new stereo i'm mounting in the glove box that accepts digital input. I'm hooking the AM radio to the speakers as well in case I want to use it instead. It will be nice to have some tunes!

So as I get close to the end of Stage 1, I can say I'm very pleased. I've gone over the body and unibody and all of the rust is very manageable. I know I'm in for a transmission rebuild/purchase down the road, just hopefully until next summer while my bank account catches up from Stage 1. I think the engine itself is very strong. I still haven't heard any unusual noises from it.

I think she's already a head turner and with the crappy roof paint job I did, she just looks like a solid survivor, which she is.

 

[74 DART']

Man i feel like i am living through you!! You have done an amazing job in a very short time. Its an awesome car and its pretty cool how the simplest things being accomplished make us so happy. Good Luck and keep it up!!

 

[dartnlo]

Man i feel like i am living through you!! You have done an amazing job in a very short time. Its an awesome car and its pretty cool how the simplest things being accomplished make us so happy. Good Luck and keep it up!!

Thanks, you are so right! It's the little victories along the way that keep us going through the troubles of rebuilding. I read your story earlier today before your comment here. I feel for you man. I had to sell my 70 Swinger almost 30 years ago while I was away at college. I've told the story of losing that car to anyone that would listen for that entire time. It feels really good to be driving a Dart again. Almost makes up for the 30 years without one!

Keep your eyes out for another project. I know you'll find one. Good luck!

 

[dartnlo]

I've been working on de-rusting the floor pan and front of rear wheel wells fro the last couple of weeks, so no major updates there yet. I did get some fluids changed; oil, ATF, and differential. The only surprises there were that the oil filter looked like it was from the mid-eighties, the differential cover plug came out easily, and the transmission had a previous broken pan bolt that had been fixed by drilling a small hole next to the bolt. The ATF was very milky looking but there weren't any parts in the pan, so yay, and a week later I don't have any leaks!

I got my dual-speaker bracket from '74 Sport. My stereo isn't exactly installed but it is hooked up. I kept the packing foam and have it encased in that and just sitting in the glove box hole. The under dash box I planned on putting in there was too big. I may end up mounting it under the seat if there is room. I didn't like any actual under-dash locations, mostly due to factory air. Today I was tired of stirring up dust with the wire grinder so I decided to put the new speakers in. I'm now very good at taking the factory radio, heater controls and ashtray out and blowing the cigarette lighter fuse.

The dual speaker bracket from Jerry is great. I added foam insulation and grille cloth. The speakers sound so much better installed than they did on the bench too. Not amazing bass, but more than I expected from 2 - 3.5" speakers.

I'll let the pictures speak for themselves for once.

 

[dartnlo]

After getting the speakers installed and trying figure out my inst. cluster lighting issues (all the sockets were each missing one ear - ordered) I decided to see what the carpet looked like. I've had it almost a month so I unboxed it and set the pieces in front of heater vents in the house to warm them up.

I got the carpet from stock interiors. The carpet looks exactly like I expected and wanted. I got the mass backing and it is hefty carpet. The only problem I have is that the factory AC evaporator coil case seems too low to the floor pan. That and there's a big lump of factory joint filler right there too. there is less than 1/4" overall so the carpet won't slide under it. I'm going to look and see how hard it is to unbolt the case temporarily so i can get the carpet in. I'm not ready to install it anyway.

None of these photos are accurate representations of the color. In the bottom picture you can see how far I can get the carpet slid under the AC. That was with quite a bit of wrestling. The jute backing would never slide up under there.

 

[dartnlo]

Just typing my thoughts out loud...

I'm hemming and hawing lately. My original plan with this car was/is to make it look good from 20 feet and ride and drive nice, but... I've got "grass is greener" syndrome. I look at all of these people doing rotisserie restorations and I know I'm capable of one, and the car surely deserves one. I need help talking me back into my original plans basically.

I've run into a lot more rust (surprise!) as I started working on the floor pans and have basically halted work as I consider my next step. So far I've decided and accepted that I'm going to have to remove the undercoating from at least the floor pans so I can wire brush and better repair the floor pan issues. None of the holes are bigger than 2" x 3" but there's one in each quarter of the floor. So that's not really the issue. I've spent an hour inside each rear wheel well scraping undercoating that is left and wire brushing. No perforations there except for the outer seat belt mount area. The rockers look solid from the side but the driver's side is very soft on the bottom in about 3 places. I was already planning on replacing the lower rear quarters and lower rear fenders with patch panels. I know new rocker panels would allow me to get inside and treat the rust inside there.

Options:
1. Continue on as planned. Do the best I can in my less than desirable Model-T garage environment. Wire brush/remove all the rust I can see and somehow slow the rust I can't touch. I want to at least feel like I'm somehow slowing its inevitable return to dust while I enjoy the car..

2. Do very little. Patch and seal up the floor and cabin so that water stops intruding and the carpet stays dry. Plan on dry weather driving only. Do quicky patches (my sheetmetal fabrications not purchased panels) on all of the body panels with rust holes and easy rust abatement. Enjoy the car and tackle the rust as it becomes a problem

3. Wait. Continue to do what I can and enjoy the car but plan on a better restoration in the future. My girlfriend is in her last semester for training to be a Physical Therapy Assistant. I work from from home and can work from anywhere with good internet access so we will likely move somewhere else in the next calendar year when she finds a good job. At that time I would look for a home with a real shop or space to build one where I could more easily work on a project like this.

Real questions I don't want to know the answer to, or I am currently ignoring the answer to:
Do any of the the "rust restorer" products actually slow down rust that you don't remove?
Will keeping the car inside slow the rust that much or will it continue to rust now that it has started? 47 years is a long time to get where it is, but I don't know how long ago it started. My last 70 Dart I had in the late 80s and early 90s had as much rust as this does. They were both midwest cars. The 70 was a Kansas car and this 72 is an Iowa car.
Will spot sandblasting help and is it worth the headache?

I'm not a very patient guy and I love driving this car around even how she runs and looks now. I'm happy with the work I've done mechanically and what little body improvements I've made. blah, blah, blah, thanks for listening to my brain blather.

Comments welcomed, reality checks welcomed, large cashier's checks very welcomed!

 

[Clelan]

Look closely at #3. If you think you will be moving soon, don't tear too much apart. Enjoy it! If you take it down for a major rebuild, that usually takes years. Once you're settled in a new location then think about getting deeper into it. Just my 2 cents! I love the car by the way.

Cley

 

[Baptist_Ben]

I’d do a combination of two and three,

Do what you need to do to slow/repair the rust, and keep on making the car better so you can enjoy it. Then once you have got a house with a shop then look at doing number one.

 

[DusterDaddy]

Just typing my thoughts out loud...

I'm hemming and hawing lately. My original plan with this car was/is to make it look good from 20 feet and ride and drive nice, but... I've got "grass is greener" syndrome. I look at all of these people doing rotisserie restorations and I know I'm capable of one, and the car surely deserves one. I need help talking me back into my original plans basically.

I've run into a lot more rust (surprise!) as I started working on the floor pans and have basically halted work as I consider my next step. So far I've decided and accepted that I'm going to have to remove the undercoating from at least the floor pans so I can wire brush and better repair the floor pan issues. None of the holes are bigger than 2" x 3" but there's one in each quarter of the floor. So that's not really the issue. I've spent an hour inside each rear wheel well scraping undercoating that is left and wire brushing. No perforations there except for the outer seat belt mount area. The rockers look solid from the side but the driver's side is very soft on the bottom in about 3 places. I was already planning on replacing the lower rear quarters and lower rear fenders with patch panels. I know new rocker panels would allow me to get inside and treat the rust inside there.

Options:
1. Continue on as planned. Do the best I can in my less than desirable Model-T garage environment. Wire brush/remove all the rust I can see and somehow slow the rust I can't touch. I want to at least feel like I'm somehow slowing its inevitable return to dust while I enjoy the car..

2. Do very little. Patch and seal up the floor and cabin so that water stops intruding and the carpet stays dry. Plan on dry weather driving only. Do quicky patches (my sheetmetal fabrications not purchased panels) on all of the body panels with rust holes and easy rust abatement. Enjoy the car and tackle the rust as it becomes a problem

3. Wait. Continue to do what I can and enjoy the car but plan on a better restoration in the future. My girlfriend is in her last semester for training to be a Physical Therapy Assistant. I work from from home and can work from anywhere with good internet access so we will likely move somewhere else in the next calendar year when she finds a good job. At that time I would look for a home with a real shop or space to build one where I could more easily work on a project like this.

Real questions I don't want to know the answer to, or I am currently ignoring the answer to:
Do any of the the "rust restorer" products actually slow down rust that you don't remove?
Will keeping the car inside slow the rust that much or will it continue to rust now that it has started? 47 years is a long time to get where it is, but I don't know how long ago it started. My last 70 Dart I had in the late 80s and early 90s had as much rust as this does. They were both midwest cars. The 70 was a Kansas car and this 72 is an Iowa car.
Will spot sandblasting help and is it worth the headache?

I'm not a very patient guy and I love driving this car around even how she runs and looks now. I'm happy with the work I've done mechanically and what little body improvements I've made. blah, blah, blah, thanks for listening to my brain blather.

Comments welcomed, reality checks welcomed, large cashier's checks very welcomed!

Mine was a rust bucket I moved my family and the project twice due to building a new home.
I used Por15 on my frame after derusting it. I replaces floor pans and quarters and got used fenders hood and decklid.
I cut the rust out of both my doorskins and welded in patches.
I vote for #3 basically what I did over 8 years...

 

[dartnlo]

Look closely at #3. If you think you will be moving soon, don't tear too much apart. Enjoy it! If you take it down for a major rebuild, that usually takes years. Once you're settled in a new location then think about getting deeper into it. Just my 2 cents! I love the car by the way.

Cley

I’d do a combination of two and three,

Do what you need to do to slow/repair the rust, and keep on making the car better so you can enjoy it. Then once you have got a house with a shop then look at doing number one.

Yeah, I think this garage is becoming the most frustrating part, especially in the winter. I just don't have the room to do anything well. Last time I put the rear end on jackstands I ended up with a dent in the back of the trunk from my restored Honda's handle grips. Waiting to see if I dented the tank on the bike. Even if this garage was empty it would still be too small to do effective work in it. I could rent a shop but I'd rather the money go into parts and materials.

Thanks!

 

[dartnlo]

Mine was a rust bucket I moved my family and the project twice due to building a new home.
I used Por15 on my frame after derusting it. I replaces floor pans and quarters and got used fenders hood and decklid.
I cut the rust out of both my doorskins and welded in patches.
I vote for #3 basically what I did over 8 years...
View attachment 1715251751 View attachment 1715251752

Yep, yours is one of them that makes me know I want to do a better job than I can do right now.

 

[dartfreak75]

Imo I think you should do what you can as you can. Take it one step at a time. It's so easy to completely disassemble a car and get overwhelmed or sidetracked or delayed or whatever and as time goes you loose parts, parts get damaged in storage etc. Ask me how I know. Keep it together drivable. If you want to do a project do only what your working on at that time.

 

[dartnlo]

Imo I think you should do what you can as you can. Take it one step at a time. It's so easy to completely disassemble a car and get overwhelmed or sidetracked or delayed or whatever and as time goes you loose parts, parts get damaged in storage etc. Ask me how I know. Keep it together drivable. If you want to do a project do only what your working on at that time.

Oh I know too! That's how I lost my 70 Dart 30 Years ago. Took it all apart, had a knee injury, went back to school, lost my storage location and ended up selling it. I'm mostly worried about doing a good enough job to combat the inevitable creep of rust.

 

[dartfreak75]

Oh I know too! That's how I lost my 70 Dart 30 Years ago. Took it all apart, had a knee injury, went back to school, lost my storage location and ended up selling it. I'm mostly worried about doing a good enough job to combat the inevitable creep of rust.

How bad rust we talking? Got any photos?
My story is my dart was my everyday driver and due to being young and dumb and honestly not knowing what the hell I was doing lol I locked the slant 6 up due to a severe oil leak. ( completely my fault) any ways I striped or completely to restore. I got the body done and painted it (el cheapo paint job) then I bought my barracuda and starting on it. It got all my attention until my first kid was born then I got away from both of them. Ended up selling all my cars except the dart. And it had sat completely gutted until now. I could never bring myself to sell it. Every spring for the last 10 years Iv said I'm gonna work on it and finally this year I got around to it. With some motivation of course lol

 

[Stephen Hotz]

The one thing I regret more than anything is I never got to drive my 67 fastback before I took my dads advice to do it right. Im one who needs to keep it drivable as I have an over active mind and short attention span if I dont keep focused. Lists help but my point is no 2 restorations or owners are the same. My vote would be 2 and 3 but that is me.

 

[skidmark]

Imo I think you should do what you can as you can. Take it one step at a time. It's so easy to completely disassemble a car and get overwhelmed or sidetracked or delayed or whatever and as time goes you loose parts, parts get damaged in storage etc. Ask me how I know. Keep it together drivable. If you want to do a project do only what your working on at that time.

Agree with dartfreak75
I too lost a car after taking it all apart. Some parts were damaged and broken over time. Had the money in the bank, garage completely redone for it. Then life happened. In hindsight for me it would have been best to drive and upgrade/repair as I could, but enjoying it as much as possible.
Enjoyed reading this, good luck to ya.

 

[DusterDaddy]

Don’t take it all apart. My son had 2 projects get away from him that he had to sell as baskets cases.

Even with my Duster that I bought with a blown motor and destroyed trans and more rust than most would tackle, I left it together and worked n one component at a time. If mine were drivable I would have made sure it stayed driveable while I worked on it.

 

[dartnlo]

How bad rust we talking? Got any photos?

Not bad, it's just that while I'm repairing the floor pan I'll be covering up rust underneath where it welds. It's places where if I had access to it, I could sand blast the area without removing a bunch more metal and buying patch panels. I just hate knowingly leaving the rust. I won't be covering any rust up. Any place I cut metal out of obviously I can remove exposed rust. It's just the rust I can't see I'm worried about right now.

This is the overall floor currently, it doesn't look too bad:

But here are the areas I'm worried about.


This one is pretty easy, I can get to the other side from the wheel well and re-fab the seat belt bolt.

This one bothers me because I wouldn't normally fabricate this piece, i would just patch in a piece over the
area after I cut out the rust on the floor. But the rust you can see now obviously extends past the area I will
be removing. The other side is actually worse and will definitely need to be patched under the car as well.

Same for this area by the passenger side seat mount.
The inner rocker frame is in need of metal replacement but I can't get to it right now.
The driver's side isn't as bad

This area is the most straightforward Not worried about this repair.

This area near the driver's pan and kick panel is also in question.

What I've been doing so far on the stuff I can see is wire wheel the rust off, spray a couple of coats of VHT rust restorer, then going back a week later, and wire wheel it again, then spray VHT again. It's thin and it makes me feel better I guess because I'm hoping it is getting in the cracks and at least encapsulating the rust. I don't know. It's a placebo to make me feel better.

 

[Alex5280]

Well...I took my car all apart once I had decided to do a complete remodel, engine swap and color change paint job. Taking it ALL apart takes commitment, careful planing, money, and for me working on it everyday doing something to advance the build. It took just over 3 years for me. If you are going to paint the engine bay, you have to remove the engine. What I would say, if I had to do it again, have the new engine/trans ready to install, do the engine bay paint, install the new engine and trans right away. Try to keep it movable on its own power. Like the others have said, it is easy for it to get away from you if all you have is a pyle of parts. Careful planning is the key. The journey is worth it!

I found her!

3 Years later:

 

[dartnlo]

Thanks everybody for the encouragement and suggestions! I know that no matter what I do, I'm adding years to this car's life. I'm just going to keep plugging away as I originally planned and then someday down the road when I have a second classic mopar to drive around maybe this one will get a more proper treatment!


Happy Thanksgiving!