Smart Meters?

[Robj]

Three weeks ago PG&E installed our new digital electric "Smart Meter". Earlier this week our water company installed a new-fangled water meter with wires coming out of it going into a module although it still has an analog display. Didn't know that one was coming until they left a note on the door that the water was going to be off for four hours.

All the people who have had these meters the longest complain of their bills immediately increasing. The response is that the exisiting electric and water meters were old and ran slow. I suppose that might be true but it doesn't help the sudden increase in bills along with the usual increases.

As far as PG&E goes, they don't need to have meter readers walking up to every house anymore. The meters report from the house. My question is that after the cost of the new meter is covered, that should translate into quite a savings to the company. Yet still my rates go up...

 

[Oklacarcollecto]

We have the new automated water meters but I haven't noticed anymore use since it was put in so my old one must have been accurate. Here with the new meters they also have a change out program to install new ones every 12 years so there will be no savings to the consumer.

 

[mopowers]

Whats the question?

 

[TrailBeast]

Even though it gets cheaper for them in labor hours, it will still go up as it has here.
On another note about those digital meters, they tend to cause some people a lot of discomfort due to the radio waves they emit.
Sleeplessness, irritability, lack of concentration are a few of the side effects for some.

You can google it if you want to find out.

 

[ddettloff]

The power company always wins they encourage people to use less then have to raise rates due to less demand and claim their cost has not decreased and the cost of production has increased.
about once a year my water bill will go up 3x in a month they always say must be a metering problem and they use the newer met err s that replaced people with technology.

 

[4spdragtop]

I work for a town in Saskatchewan in water treatment and the town just installed the smart meters for water usage. Complaints are the same, now my bill is too hgh!! The answer "no, your old bill was too low"

Dunno who the mfg is for the water meters Rob, up here they use Neptune. It was a pricy expenditure to replace them all(town of 5400 people). It is impossible for the old style water meter to turn "too fast" it can only be "slowed down"(full/partly plugged)

The meters we read can be done so from a truck with a hand held unit. Our rates we charge for water is $11 for 1000 gallons. Equates to 1cent per gallon for government compliant clean potable water....yet I see people buy bottled water for $2 a bottle...and NOT gov regulated..LOL

You would be surprised how many people call to ***** about their water bill, then we do a drive by on their house and their sprinkler is running watering their driveway and the sidewalk and flowing down the street:banghead:

Sorry for the long "rant" Im a water guy and no offense to you, but people just cease to amaze me.
Water rates are only going to continue to increase too.

 

[67Dart273]

they tend to cause some people a lot of discomfort due to the radio waves they emit.
Sleeplessness, irritability, lack of concentration are a few of the side effects for some.

You can google it if you want to find out.

I can guarantee you that this is bullshit

It is likely that the RF wireless device in your laptop / touch-thing-pad / cellphone / blutooth puts out more RF radiation than do these meters

(The gas meters are powered by a long term battery so they cannot possibly put out very much)


I've heard all sorts of internet stories about the war on these, but these are the "rules."

All public utilities, whether cable, phone, or power, etc, have what is essentially the "demark" or demarcation. This is the point at which "theirs" becomes "yours." This can vary some, from locale to locale.

In the case of (our local) power co, "they" own the right to come onto your property for maintenance, disconnection, and meter reading, and "they" get to put whatever kind of equipment is needed to carry that out

"You" own downstream of the meter, AKA the "fuse panel."

Unless you can PROVE the new meter is not accurate or somehow being manipulated, "good luck" with that.

And, if you wanted to spend the money, you COULD. You COULD buy yourself metering equipment, have it installed by a licensed electrician downstream of the companies meter, and install whatever "approved" metering / logging equipment you need to "meter" the "meter."

 

[4spdragtop]

Here is a link to the Neptune water meter. There are 2 pictured, but the one we use is the one on the left. These are triple checked for qa/qc by the mfg. They are checked at 3 different levels of flow thru the meter and are paperwork attached with s/n to prove it.
At the water treatment plant it is up to our discretion if we send the "faulty" meter out for a calibration check. This MAY cost the customer/resident $120.

Back home in Lakefield(where house and family is) our water is NOT metered, but it is soon going to be. Im not looking forward to it, but I know what is involved with making potable water. It is the only substance on earth you CANT live without...so what is that worth??

Here's the link
[ame]http://www.neptuneequipment.com/pdf/endpoints/R900IMaintenance.pdf[/ame]

 

[Robj]

Here is a link to the Neptune water meter. There are 2 pictured, but the one we use is the one on the left. These are triple checked for qa/qc by the mfg. They are checked at 3 different levels of flow thru the meter and are paperwork attached with s/n to prove it.
At the water treatment plant it is up to our discretion if we send the "faulty" meter out for a calibration check. This MAY cost the customer/resident $120.

Back home in Lakefield(where house and family is) our water is NOT metered, but it is soon going to be. Im not looking forward to it, but I know what is involved with making potable water. It is the only substance on earth you CANT live without...so what is that worth??

Here's the link
http://www.neptuneequipment.com/pdf/endpoints/R900IMaintenance.pdf

I finally got past your avatar and realized you've actually posted! Seriously I understand all that, just crying in my beer a little. Looking forward to a long weeknd beginning...now. What a week...

 

[4spdragtop]

I finally got past your avatar and realized you've actually posted! Seriously I understand all that, just crying in my beer a little. Looking forward to a long weeknd beginning...now. What a week...

LOL, hey I dont blame ya with the beer n crying thing. Once/if I ever get my arse home we gots meters coming too. Speaking of crying...wanna talk temperature/weather??? LOL

 

[Robj]

LOL, hey I dont blame ya with the beer n crying thing. Once/if I ever get my arse home we gots meters coming too. Speaking of crying...wanna talk temperature/weather??? LOL

Ha ha a couple weeks ago we had record cold and now it's record heat. Last weekend I was driving around in short sleeves with the window down in the Dart. Worst drought though since the '30s. Oh yeah...water prices...lol

 

[67Dart273]

I would bet that "on average" peoples bills DO go up from a 20 - some year old mechanical meter to a new one. "Back when" I serviced gas appliances, I actually checked firing rate when doing things like replacing a gas valve (regulator.) On a unit with a meter, you can check yourself by checking gas pressure (inches of water) and or clock the meter. When you get one that shows proper gas pressure with proper sized orifices, but the meter reads "way slow" you know the customer has been "getting by cheap."

The chances of a meter running "too fast" are actually fairly slim

 

[Chuckman]

At least your water company / local government does not do like ours does. As I posted before, some people on a dead end street had their wells go dry. (About 6 families on a street of about 30.) They petitioned the county for a water line, and the county agreed to put on in, BUT!

Everyone that owns a piece of property the new line crosses must pay $20,000, and a $5,000 hook up fee. Even if their well is still good, they will be required by law to hookup. What this means is some people may lose their homes, because they cannot afford to fork over $25,000 to the county.

 

[Back in Time]

Even when we did the periodic change out on the mechanical gas meters the bill would increase a little. Extremely rare for a meter to register fast....if any thing they usually favored the customer.We were required by law to pull so many meters a year and put them on a prover to test accuracy of the sample meters and report it to the State .The new smart meters are basically the same as the old ones with a transmitter added.In 2009 when I retired we retrofitted 40,000 meters with transmitters. Last year they changed every one of them for a factory built smart meter with a different type of transmitter where they "read" them from a devise installed on cell phone towers.

 

[1968FormulaS340]

The new "Smart Meters" have built in devices that can listen to and transmit conversations taking place within 25' of any wall outlet powered through that meter.

The new meters also have a camera that can watch and transmit whatever is going on within view of the meter.

We keep our meter covered in tinfoil and use a white noise device that plugs into one outlet in every room.

 

[Robj]

The new "Smart Meters" have built in devices that can listen to and transmit conversations taking place within 25' of any wall outlet powered through that meter.

The new meters also have a camera that can watch and transmit whatever is going on within view of the meter.

We keep our meter covered in tinfoil and use a white noise device that plugs into one outlet in every room.

You Oregonians! Ha Ha You've all been exposed to too many chemtrails!

 

[4spdragtop]

Ha ha a couple weeks ago we had record cold and now it's record heat. Last weekend I was driving around in short sleeves with the window down in the Dart. Worst drought though since the '30s. Oh yeah...water prices...lol

I moved out here to Saskatchewan at the end of April 2013. The winter where I was basically just "finished" but they broke 50 year levels for snow. This winter I am now an hour south of where I started and they have been breaking 50-60 year lows in temps(-50*c). This province is starting to get to me. Hopefully summer(if im still here) this year, will land on a Saturday AND a Sunday this year!! LOL

Jealous...window down...arm out the window....in yer Dart in California....yep Jealous

 

[67Dart273]

The new "Smart Meters" have built in devices that can listen to and transmit conversations taking place within 25' of any wall outlet powered through that meter.

The new meters also have a camera that can watch and transmit whatever is going on within view of the meter.

We keep our meter covered in tinfoil and use a white noise device that plugs into one outlet in every room.

And here I was thinking you were intelligent. ??REALLY??

 

[64DartGTinAZ]

A friend's smart meter just went bad (no power to the house). The repair guy showed up. I asked how often they had to replace the smart meters? He said "a lot more than the old ones…but they figure they're saving money because more truck rolls cost less than the entire department they eliminated." (Meter readers)

 

[1968FormulaS340]

And here I was thinking you were intelligent. ??REALLY??

No, not really. A meter is just a meter. I believe, if your bill changes after the installation, more than likely, it is because you have moved from one that was inaccurate to one that is reading correctly.

 

[Back in Time]

No, not really. A meter is just a meter. I believe, if your bill changes after the installation, more than likely, it is because you have moved from one that was inaccurate to one that is reading correctly.

Correct

 

[70aarcuda]

Nevada Power allows you to op out of the smart meter...but they charge you an additional fee to read the old meter..

 

[KitCarlson]

Water meters here are mechanical with an add-on, for remote reading by vehicle. It is possible to read dial on the mechanical readout to check your bill. The little rotating cog helps when looking for leaks.

I have developed 3-phase electric power meters, and have electrical/gas utility engineering experience. Much work goes into accuracy and electromagnetic compatibility (EMC). The EMC insures that the units meet standards for susceptibility to external electrical noise, and electrical noise emissions by meter. Meter accuracy is also well verified by independent labs. Utilities typically audit meter accuracy, by pulling a sample of units from the field, to identify inaccuracy that may happen over time.

 

[TrailBeast]

I can guarantee you that this is bullshit

So you feel that all of "those" people's issue's are caused by just knowing the electronic meter is there?
(Not a smartass question) as I know people do this kind of stuff.

My Mother in law will somtimes say to us "Your neighbor must be smoking, because I'm getting a headache" :-D
Seriously.

It makes me laugh, but I try to keep an open mind about stuff like this as being at least possible until proven otherwise.
I do know that apparently some people are RF sensitive, so this is where I thought this was centered.

 

[Robj]

My Mother in law will somtimes say to us "Your neighbor must be smoking, because I'm getting a headache" :-D

When I was young and living in Danbury, Ct, there was a clothing store downtown that I used to dread going into whenever my mom would drag my sister and I in there. I would hear this super high pitched noise I came to find out later was the lighting. It wasn't even hardly a noise, more of a ringing feeling in my head.

They knew I hated having to hang around while they shopped for clothes and thought I was just being punk when I'd tell them I was going to wait outside. They heard nothing and it would always end in a huge argument because my mom thought I was fibbing to her just to get out.

I have found that aluminum foil hats do help these days...