The average 408...

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Its all about the cam and heads,most guys build a 408 the same way as a 360 or 340 and think they will gain horsepower from the extra cubes.They dont realize what they really accomplished was to move to power down in a more streetable range and produce alot more torque.I guess its all what you want but I would take advantage of the stroke and put alot more cam and head on it then you would see 500 plus as other here have done.
 
I know about that low oil pressure issue. My dyno guy wasn't exactly sure what it could be, and he has seen it before a few times, but nothing was wrong with the engines. We changed to a high volume oil pump as well, it didn't affect the oil pressure..I talked to Dave at Hughes Engines as well, he is also aware of the oil pressure, but he said the engine will be fine as he said it's a"loose" engine if you will...I guess cause of the clearances of the main and rod bearings...
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What about the spring? I think Hughes is pulling your leg (Imagine that), I have had wore *** out 360's, with more pressure than that. I have built "loose" engines before, and ran wore out bottom ends to the point of knocking before the 20W50 reached the bearings, and they were at least 10psi per 1K. Is it a hughes engine?

Every Mopar SB I have built had 75psi by 5K. Not dogging your motor, I just wonder if the cam bearings are loose, or something, mains? I just dont want to see a thread here next year..... My motor blew up. You know, watchin' out for ya.


Its all about the cam and heads,most guys build a 408 the same way as a 360 or 340 and think they will gain horsepower from the extra cubes.They dont realize what they really accomplished was to move to power down in a more streetable range and produce alot more torque.I guess its all what you want but I would take advantage of the stroke and put alot more cam and head on it then you would see 500 plus as other here have done.
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Exactly, because of the stroke, you can use a much bigger cam, and still get the same, or better numbers down below than a non stroker. Example, take the 4" crank out of my 390, and I really don't think it would even idle in gear, let alone pull a trailer from a stop, LOL. I also beleive the bigger cam/heads on the stroker motors makes a bigger difference in power output than bigger cam/heads on a non stroker.
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
360z,
why are you posting this crap ?

come on man...100%+ ve on 260 something cfm heads that would have to hold that to .600 which is where the cam would be lifting or around along with 11.1 and then whats the intake flow let alone were looking at a higher rpm unless exagerated flow like 300's cfm is there....

If you had the time & $$$ for this 540hp 360, you'd think you could afford an a-b-e body mopar.
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crap.. hardly lol. 104% VE actually. not a .6 cam thats for sure. lol.
little more then 11:1. 300cfm not likely from a 302. you should know that.
its not like the ports were brazed or anything lol. pinch eliminated. all
that fun stuff. lol. i have an a-body. a 73 duster. camaro is sold.
theres plenty of production iron headed smallblocks running around with
500+ horsepower. you should also know that. just harder to do. much
easier with W2/5's etc. + those 3/8 stems are killing me lol.

!EDIT!
have some repairing to do but it did come with fiberglass fenders and hood
Presenting... the A-BOMB II...
75DUSTER004.jpg


15 years of dust, crud, acorns, squirrel and mouse crap on the engine lol:
75DUSTER003.jpg
 
dodgetkboy78 said:
What about the spring? I think Hughes is pulling your leg (Imagine that), I have had wore *** out 360's, with more pressure than that. I have built "loose" engines before, and ran wore out bottom ends to the point of knocking before the 20W50 reached the bearings, and they were at least 10psi per 1K. Is it a hughes engine?

Every Mopar SB I have built had 75psi by 5K. Not dogging your motor, I just wonder if the cam bearings are loose, or something, mains? I just dont want to see a thread here next year..... My motor blew up. You know, watchin' out for ya.
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Yes, hughes engines built me the short block. i sent him my edelbrock heads to get ported too, he changed the valves and springs....i know ur not dogging my engine, just lookin out and thank you...i am concerned about this still, even though it has been a year since it has ran on the dyno. (and since then its just sitting on the stand waiting for my car to be complete). now that it's all together, i dont know what my options are, and i really dont want to spend any more money on this engine, i have alot into it...i understand this COULD be very harmful to it...just dunno what i could do...
 
dodgetkboy78 said:
What about the spring? I think Hughes is pulling your leg (Imagine that), I have had wore *** out 360's, with more pressure than that. I have built "loose" engines before, and ran wore out bottom ends to the point of knocking before the 20W50 reached the bearings, and they were at least 10psi per 1K. Is it a hughes engine?

Every Mopar SB I have built had 75psi by 5K. Not dogging your motor, I just wonder if the cam bearings are loose, or something, mains? I just dont want to see a thread here next year..... My motor blew up. You know, watchin' out for ya.
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Correction: I just understood the spring question. And another thing: The oil pump that's in my engine now is a standard volume melling oil pump. I never switched to a high volume, I thought I did, but we didn't do that. SO, maybe if I switch the oil pressure relief spring to a stiffer one, this could possibly fix the problem...

I've just read in my "how to hot rod small block mopar" book that the stock oil pump and spring tends to run at a max of 50 psi. If I were to change it to a high performance unit I'd be at 70 psi.

So, I think that's what it could be.
 
If you can't get atleast 500h.p. out of a stroker its time for a new builder..my 416 with a set of cleaned up out of the box Edelbrocks and a .533/.552 hyd. cam pumped out 520 h.p. and 500 lbs of tq...on the dyno,and we probably could have gotten a little more with some more tuning time...
 
Hell all the threads I have read on various boards guys are getting 500 hp Easily with very mild combos in their 408 motors.
 
I wonder how many extra lbs you need spring wise to keep those 3/8 valves controlled over a lighter after market 11/32 with undercut.
Next you'll be ragging on the lighter hollow MP solid lifter that I'm using too or the hollow tube comp pushrods, cause I guess heavier is better right...

Using the least amount of spring pressure necessary to control the valves is a way to get a fast rev, less friction/resistance, and thats what can come down to sometimes for the win.

Still waiting to hear the magical combo and flow #'s, how about pics too, for heads as great as those must of had documentation...
 
Some guys race cars, some race oil pumps.

It would be interesting to put it back on the dyno to see how many HP those extra 20 PSI cost you.
 
75 pound spring, forget the HV oil pump....... Whats your oil pressure?


Still waiting to hear the magical combo and flow #'s, how about pics too, for heads as great as those must of had documentation...
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YES! Because I am sending my 302's to the same place for porting!
 
mopardude318 said:
I went to the shop lase week and he still had the dyno sheet saved on his computer. He did about 10 different pulls, this one shows a peak horsepower of 533 @ 5900 RPM. Peak torque is 513 @ 5100 RPM...

He didn't print me out the one before this one where he made a jet change, and I got 520 FT LBS. Anyways, heres the dyno chart.

dynochart.jpg
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mopardude318,

Nice setip. Interesting ... I think your setup has less cubes (I am ~423 - 4" x 4.1") but the rpm HP peak is very similar. I would have expected yours to peak at a higher RPM than me.... I guess it is all about the heads.
Kory

DynoRun (Large).jpg
 
mopardude318 said:
I went to the shop lase week and he still had the dyno sheet saved on his computer. He did about 10 different pulls, this one shows a peak horsepower of 533 @ 5900 RPM. Peak torque is 513 @ 5100 RPM...

He didn't print me out the one before this one where he made a jet change, and I got 520 FT LBS. Anyways, heres the dyno chart.


1wild&crazyguy said:
Nice, What heads and head flow?
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Eddy - also done by Hughes. I no longer have the flow info, sorry.
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dodgetkboy78 said:
75 pound spring, forget the HV oil pump....... Whats your oil pressure?
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Yes, I will change out the spring. IIRC sometimes a high volume pump doesn't necessarily give you more oil pressure Unless you also change the spring.

C130 Chief said:
Some guys race cars, some race oil pumps.

It would be interesting to put it back on the dyno to see how many HP those extra 20 PSI cost you.
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Once I change it to that high rate spring, I'll see how the pressure reads on my mechanical gauge. If its the same...then I guess I'll pull it apart and check EVERYTHING. But it will still have to wait until it goes in the car...which won't be for at least till summertime..
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
this is the worst thing about the internet...
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Yes I agree. I started my 410 build with 600hp as the goal based on the CRAP off the internet and a GURU on this site that turned out to be FOS and you all know who I am referring to.

Based on what I see as REAL numbers now. If it hits 520hp/500tq I better just be happy and deal with it! We will see on Friday at the Dyno...

It WILL make over 600 hp when I SHOVE a 200 shot down its throat for sure!!!!!!!!
 
Mad Dart said:
Yes I agree. I started my 410 build with 600hp as the goal based on the CRAP off the internet and a GURU on this site that turned out to be FOS and you all know who I am referring to.

Based on what I see as REAL numbers now. If it hits 520hp/500tq I better just be happy and deal with it! We will see on Friday at the Dyno...

It WILL make over 600 hp when I SHOVE a 200 shot down its throat for sure!!!!!!!!
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If you went with ported Indy 360-1 aluminum heads,12.5 comp and a nasty solid roller, you could have 600hp without the funny stuff.

It'll make good power MAD.
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
If you went with ported Indy 360-1 aluminum heads,12.5 comp and a nasty solid roller, you could have 600hp without the funny stuff.

It'll make good power MAD.
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Yes I know about the Indy 360-1 heads, Just learned that a few weeks ago......a little too late is all. Then I would have needed to upgrade the block.......

haaaa:-D
 
I think guessing on any engine is just that. I know engines with components for 600hp that can't make 500. There's just too many variables to really say based on parts lists alone. Especially considering the vast differences in ability nd equipment doing the machining.
 
Who can explain what a ''happy dyno'' is and why and HOW it can be made ''happy''.

Who tunes the dyno?

Do people think these are out of calibration?

If so, which one is out of calibration, the happy one or the not happy one?

How does one know which is ''honest''
 
1wild&crazyguy said:
Who can explain what a ''happy dyno'' is and why and HOW it can be made ''happy''.

Who tunes the dyno?

Do people think these are out of calibration?

If so, which one is out of calibration, the happy one or the not happy one?

How does one know which is ''honest''
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Correction factors in the software. You can manipulate the numbers all you want based on parameters/values you input into certain fields. Some dynos have a 4-5% fluff factor in them, others don't. Those fluff factors can be altered at will by any dyno operator that knows their way around the software.

The ultimate dyno is the track where, MPH and weight will tell you rear wheel HP. Then you get tons of other factors in the mix, converters on auto cars being one of the biggest.
 
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