Turning radius reduced.

Discussion in 'Suspension, Steering and Chassis' started by Cope, Nov 23, 2018.

  1. Cope

    Cope Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,163
    Likes Received:
    1369
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2009
    Location:
    South Lake Tahoe
    Local Time:
    12:45 AM
    So I got my 73 and up disk conversion on my 71 dart and the turning radius is garbage...

    Is this a normal thing?

    The car turned great before the swap.
    Any ideas why it sucks so bad now?
     
  2. Alaskan_TA

    Alaskan_TA Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,976
    Likes Received:
    1679
    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2004
    Location:
    PA
    Local Time:
    1:45 AM
    Did you take it to an alignment shop after the swap?
     
  3. pishta

    pishta I know I'm right....

    Messages:
    13,439
    Likes Received:
    3203
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2004
    Location:
    Tustin, CA
    View My Photos
    Local Time:
    10:45 PM
    Hit the gas a little harder in the turn. Were the spindles the same size where it attached to the tie rods? Longer tie rod mounts will increase the turning radius and your track did increase 1" per side IIRC going to disks.
     
  4. Kern Dog

    Kern Dog Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,445
    Likes Received:
    1744
    Joined:
    May 23, 2010
    Location:
    Granite bay CA
    Local Time:
    10:45 PM
    If the turning radius were actually reduced, I'd be bragging about that!
    I think that you mean that it has increased, meaning the turning circle is larger now.
    On the lower ball joint steering arms, there are "steering stops" that make contact with a section of the lower control arm. Those nubs can be ground down, allowing the steering linkage to travel further.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • 67Dart273

      67Dart273 Well-Known Member

      Messages:
      38,083
      Likes Received:
      5678
      Joined:
      Oct 14, 2010
      Location:
      Idaho
      View My Photos
      Local Time:
      10:45 PM
      Do you mean reduced or increased?

      I can still remember I had a 63 Ranchero for a short while, while I still had the 70RR. I lived one way from a friend's house, and sometimes I'd pull a "u-ey" in the street to park in front. The little Falcon based Ranchero WOULD NOT turn a U in that street, but the big RR did, no problem LOL
       
    • bcschief

      bcschief Well-Known Member

      Messages:
      344
      Likes Received:
      27
      Joined:
      Feb 23, 2010
      Location:
      Crescent City Florida
      Local Time:
      1:45 AM
      Lower ball joint bolts need to have the bolt heads to the inside. I bet you have the nuts to the inside.

      Brian
       
    • 1994redram

      1994redram FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

      Messages:
      909
      Likes Received:
      388
      Joined:
      May 9, 2012
      Location:
      Oklahoma
      Local Time:
      12:45 AM
      Don't you have a spool? It's likely that the locked rear axle is "pushing" the front end while trying to make a tight turn. Been there, done that, won't do it again.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
      • RustyRatRod

        RustyRatRod Just another dumbass. FABO Gold Member

        Messages:
        46,955
        Likes Received:
        11644
        Joined:
        Jun 7, 2010
        Location:
        Georgia
        View My Photos
        Local Time:
        1:45 AM
        Are the calipers on the front or rear side of the rotors? If they are on the front, (incorrect) they are hitting the strut rods and stopping from turning any sharper.
         
      • Kern Dog

        Kern Dog Well-Known Member

        Messages:
        2,445
        Likes Received:
        1744
        Joined:
        May 23, 2010
        Location:
        Granite bay CA
        Local Time:
        10:45 PM
        The 73-76 A body setup had the calipers forward of axle centerline.
         
      • RustyRatRod

        RustyRatRod Just another dumbass. FABO Gold Member

        Messages:
        46,955
        Likes Received:
        11644
        Joined:
        Jun 7, 2010
        Location:
        Georgia
        View My Photos
        Local Time:
        1:45 AM
        Right, but seems I remember the calipers have to be swapped to the rear on the earlier cars. I might be imagining things, but I am almost certain I have had to do it before. Something about the early strut rods were in a different spot. Hell, I might be crazy.
         
        • Agree Agree x 1
        • 72bluNblu

          72bluNblu FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

          Messages:
          8,921
          Likes Received:
          2852
          Joined:
          Nov 28, 2008
          Location:
          NorCal
          Local Time:
          10:45 PM
          So I’ll clean this up some. The 73+ cars do have their calipers mounted to the front, they don’t hit the strut rods. And that’s true on any 67-76 car, the strut rods don’t change locations.

          But, since this is talking about 73+ calipers on a ‘71, the front mounted calipers can interfere with the 67-72 style sway bar. You can either mount the calipers to the rear or modify the end links to clear the sway bar.
           
          • Agree Agree x 1
          • RustyRatRod

            RustyRatRod Just another dumbass. FABO Gold Member

            Messages:
            46,955
            Likes Received:
            11644
            Joined:
            Jun 7, 2010
            Location:
            Georgia
            View My Photos
            Local Time:
            1:45 AM
            That might have been what it was. I just remember doing a Dart years ago and the calipers hit SOMETHING. Might have been the sway bar.
             
          • Cope

            Cope Well-Known Member

            Messages:
            2,163
            Likes Received:
            1369
            Joined:
            Oct 20, 2009
            Location:
            South Lake Tahoe
            Local Time:
            12:45 AM
            I'll check the bolt heads on the lower ball joint.

            Yeah I didn't think about the spool pushing the front but that could be it....
             
          • mopowers

            mopowers Well-Known Member

            Messages:
            3,720
            Likes Received:
            887
            Joined:
            Feb 15, 2006
            Location:
            West Sacramento, CA
            Local Time:
            10:45 PM
            I'm betting on the spool. Turning is a bitch with those things.
             
            Last edited: Nov 26, 2018
            • Agree Agree x 1
            • ir3333

              ir3333 Well-Known Member

              Messages:
              4,177
              Likes Received:
              635
              Joined:
              Jun 1, 2008
              Location:
              ontario,canada
              Local Time:
              12:45 AM
              remove / grind about 1/8th" off the stops on the ball joints.
               
              • Like Like x 1
              • lilcuda

                lilcuda Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                1,082
                Likes Received:
                54
                Joined:
                Apr 15, 2006
                Local Time:
                10:45 PM
                This.

                Had to do this exact thing on my old 66 Barracuda when I did this upgrade several years ago. Measure them before starting and carefully grind them the same amount so the turning radius is the same in both directions.
                 
              • Johnny Mac

                Johnny Mac www.blueprintengines.com FABO Vendor

                Messages:
                2,371
                Likes Received:
                835
                Joined:
                Jul 10, 2010
                Location:
                OHIO
                View My Photos
                Local Time:
                1:45 AM
                Would this have anything to do with the wider track width? Aren't 73+ spindles/discs out further than earlier models?
                 
              • Marcohotrod

                Marcohotrod Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                2,098
                Likes Received:
                468
                Joined:
                Mar 21, 2015
                Location:
                Massachusetts
                Local Time:
                1:45 AM
                I have a spool and 12" wide rear tires and it turns a tight turn well, manual steering, you can hear and feel some scuffing
                 
              • Cope

                Cope Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                2,163
                Likes Received:
                1369
                Joined:
                Oct 20, 2009
                Location:
                South Lake Tahoe
                Local Time:
                12:45 AM
                Marco did you grind the stops?
                 
              • j par

                j par Well-hung Member

                Messages:
                10,303
                Likes Received:
                3599
                Joined:
                Jul 2, 2014
                Location:
                Portland Oregon
                View My Photos
                Local Time:
                10:45 PM
                Can you see something hitting?
                 
              • Cope

                Cope Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                2,163
                Likes Received:
                1369
                Joined:
                Oct 20, 2009
                Location:
                South Lake Tahoe
                Local Time:
                12:45 AM
                I have had a chance to check it out yet, maybe friday.
                 
                • Like Like x 1
                • Marcohotrod

                  Marcohotrod Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  2,098
                  Likes Received:
                  468
                  Joined:
                  Mar 21, 2015
                  Location:
                  Massachusetts
                  Local Time:
                  1:45 AM
                  I am saying driving on the street with a spool is no big deal, doing it since 1985. I have 1969 10" front drums and 1968 11" rear drums. no grinding
                   
                • Cope

                  Cope Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  2,163
                  Likes Received:
                  1369
                  Joined:
                  Oct 20, 2009
                  Location:
                  South Lake Tahoe
                  Local Time:
                  12:45 AM
                  Turning was great with the drums, it changed when I went to the 73 disks.
                   
                • lilcuda

                  lilcuda Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  1,082
                  Likes Received:
                  54
                  Joined:
                  Apr 15, 2006
                  Local Time:
                  10:45 PM
                  Not due to track width. It's the lower ball joint.
                   
                • lilcuda

                  lilcuda Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  1,082
                  Likes Received:
                  54
                  Joined:
                  Apr 15, 2006
                  Local Time:
                  10:45 PM
                  It's not from a spool. It's from the fact that the lower ball joint has a nub on it that limits how far the ball joint can travel. Grinding it down fixes the problem.

                  10" front drum brake cars don't have this issue.