Water in #6 cylinder?

[homecloned]

This is copied from my resto page. Any input is welcome. I am not a experienced engine builder, this was my second rebuild(first was a 4 cylinder Honda) which was fine when finished.
I spent the better part of the morning yesterday searching the FABO search forums on the subject and i'm thinking I am screwed.

From resto page.
OK. Dropped the 340 in after priming the oil system, had trouble getting the fuel pump/system to prime. Rerouted fuel line into can of gas and was able to keep running for the 20 min cam break-in. Kept house fan blowing through the radiator. Everything seemed ok, oil pressure stayed @50psi. I did notice some moisture comming from the exhaust at first but it stopped after a few minutes. Got up thursday morning to do some more work and noticed low water in the radiator. Tried to start engine and it wouldn't move. I freak out and just stare at it for a minute. Decide to pull the plugs and cylinder 6 is wet. I bump the starter and it shoots water across the garage.(at least it turned over) I think I am totally screwed! I will pull the top end apart today to see what I did or didn't do. Hoping it's a bad head gasket and not a cracked head or worse cracked block. :angry7:
No machine work was done as it ran when pulled. The cam was bad so I decided to replace all bearings and rings as well as cam and lifters.
This took the wind out of my sails for Thanksgiving.
One step forward three steps back.:angry7::angry7::angry7:
I will update later, hopefully with an idea of what happened.

 

[RedFish]

Some engines have a little water tube between head and block. I've seen them fall out or scar the head gasket as the head is set on.
Let us know what you find.

 

[homecloned]

Some engines have a little water tube between head and block. I've seen them fall out or scar the head gasket as the head is set on.
Let us know what you find.

Thanks RedFish. I am hoping it's the head gasket. When I assembled the engine I think I had to remove one of the heads after it was torqued once, (it's been so long I can't remember why or which one, just that I did). I need to keep a journal for these things. It sounded good during break-in.

 

[jefflock]

Did you replace the gasket after torquing it down and removing the head???
I had to replace a set of head gaskets on mine since I had to pull the heads back off because the machine shop didn't mill the intake side. They had never been run.

 

[homecloned]

Did you replace the gasket after torquing it down and removing the head???
I had to replace a set of head gaskets on mine since I had to pull the heads back off because the machine shop didn't mill the intake side. They had never been run.

No I didn't Jeff. I am hoping it's the gasket. I am headed out to the garage to take it apart. Thanks for the response.

 

[daredevil]

hoping for the best. hate to hear this.
post some pics of block head and gasket. Did you chase all the head bolt holes or retorque to make sure you didnt miss one.

 

[homecloned]

hoping for the best. hate to hear this.
post some pics of block head and gasket. Did you chase all the head bolt holes or retorque to make sure you didnt miss one.

Thanks DD. I just removed the head and to my eye it looks ok. I laid a straight across the head and it looks good. Gasket doesn't look blown. I did chase the bolt holes. The bolts inside the head were much tighter then the ones on the outside. I torqued them per Chiltons specs and sequence. I will go out and snap some pics in a minute

 

[1wild&crazyguy]

what was done to the heads?

'sometimes' when they cut for hardened seats on the exhaust they hit water and after the pressing, if not done right as in they let the jig/table move while cutting the seat does not press in tight enough and it leaks.
probably for you, being you said the bolts had resistance, it's the torque was not sufficient.

 

[homecloned]

what was done to the heads?

'sometimes' when they cut for hardened seats on the exhaust they hit water and after the pressing, if not done right as in they let the jig/table move while cutting the seat does not press in tight enough and it leaks.
probably for you, being you said the bolts had resistance, it's the torque was not sufficient.

Thanks for the response 1wcg. No head work done from me but thses are not origional to this engine.

I'm hoping its a torgue issue but would it just be confined to one cylinder?

Here are some pics.

 

[daredevil]

Fire ring imprint isnt pronounced on the head by the water jacket. are those m/p gaskets? i would use some good permatex blue permatorque gaskets.

 

[RedFish]

This doesn't look good to me. I would have the head checked before bolting it back on.

 

[homecloned]

Fire ring imprint isnt pronounced on the head by the water jacket. are those m/p gaskets? i would use some good permatex blue permatorque gaskets.

I think they are fel-pro.

 

[homecloned]

This doesn't look good to me. I would have the head checked before bolting it back on.

Here is a better pic. I cleaned it up some. I will still probably have them both checked.
Thanks RedFish.

 

[1wild&crazyguy]

lose the over the counter felpros and get the blue perm torque felpros.

those black felpros suck.

you need to clean them heads WAY better than you did.

razor scrape, brake clean, light sand paper, brake clean, then assemble.

I'd be having the heads surfaced at this point though...

 

[1wild&crazyguy]

those heads don't look like they came off of a fresh 'cam run time only' engine, you need to clean them way better.

it looks as if there is old gasket still on the head, and not from this build...

 

[homecloned]

lose the over the counter felpros and get the blue perm torque felpros.

those black felpros suck.

you need to clean them heads WAY better than you did.

razor scrape, brake clean, light sand paper, brake clean, then assemble.

I'd be having the heads surfaced at this point though...

Thanks. Should I have the machine shop order the gaskets or try and find them myself?

 

[homecloned]

those heads don't look like they came off of a fresh 'cam run time only' engine, you need to clean them way better.

it looks as if there is old gasket still on the head, and not from this build...

Old gasket was removed and scraped but I was trying not to score the surface. Thanks again, all responses are welcome.

 

[1wild&crazyguy]

jegs

http://www.jegs.com/i/Fel-Pro/375/8553PT/10002/-1?parentProductId=746666

 

[homecloned]

jegs

http://www.jegs.com/i/Fel-Pro/375/8553PT/10002/-1?parentProductId=746666

Thanks. I will order a couple of those and call around about resurfacing the heads.

 

[homecloned]

those heads don't look like they came off of a fresh 'cam run time only' engine, you need to clean them way better.

it looks as if there is old gasket still on the head, and not from this build...

I am inspection these with my glasses on and I was either drunk or stoned when I cleaned these. Thanks for the heads up 1wild&crazyguy. I am hoping this will solve the issue.

 

[67Dart273]

lose the over the counter felpros and get the blue perm torque felpros.

those black felpros suck.

you need to clean them heads WAY better than you did.

razor scrape, brake clean, light sand paper, brake clean, then assemble.

I'd be having the heads surfaced at this point though...

THIS. You COULD have a cracked head or even a block problem, but retorqueing used gaskets, especially those "multi piece" affairs just can't work, and those heads are NOT ready to go back on.

Also, I'd consider pulling the valves in the affected cylinders and inspecting the ports and around the valve seats

 

[1wild&crazyguy]

Anytime bro.

 

[homecloned]

THIS. You COULD have a cracked head or even a block problem, but retorqueing used gaskets, especially those "multi piece" affairs just can't work, and those heads are NOT ready to go back on.

Also, I'd consider pulling the valves in the affected cylinders and inspecting the ports and around the valve seats

Thanks 67DArt273. I was just out messing around and have cleaned off more old gasket that I missed somehow.

 

[homecloned]

Well it turnes out my block was cracked in the cylinder just below the ring line but starting to spread upward. This was not visible when I put it together and I didn't notice anything when I pulled it 4 years ago. It ran fine but had flettened a couple cam lobes from crappy oil pressure(im guessing). I should of had the blocked checked but was on a budget. My guess is with the new rings and added pressure it just gave way finally but was probably there for a while underneath.:angry7: Everything about this car has been mickey moused at one point or another by PO just to resale. But for 800 clams I can't complain to much, it just kicks my *** to do things two and sometimes three times. Atleast im learning.
I located a 71 340 block from a local member here for a fair price(thank you rampage340) and will take it to the shop tomorrow with my pistons and haved it bored some. Mine are stamped os on the tops and will not fit the bores. No big deal, I hope. Just $$. I do not have the tools to get a acurate measurment. They look to be slightly under 4 1/16" in dia. with the calipers I have.
Don't trash me to bad for being a rookie shade tree mechanic. Just trying to learn as I go for future projects, which I have on this one. And whatever I put into her its still cheaper the a monthly car payment.
Thanks for reading and to those who offerd thier help.

 

[mopardude318]

that sucks man. Im sorry to hear. It will be even better now with a fresh 340.