**71 Dart wont start after CAM, Timing Chain and HEAD Cylinder install** HELP

[Rob38e]

• Hi, I recently in stalled a new Cam with lifters, Pushrods and Aluminum Heads. Car was running prior to installing these new parts. Engine is cracking, but that's all its doing! also carburetor shots random fuel mist when I crank.
• Here's my question when I installed the timing chain I made sure the two dots lined up and piston 1# one was at top dead center. However the indicator line/Timer mark on the harmonic balancer was not aligned to the zero (0) mark on the plate tab. Was this also suppose to be aligned?
• Secondly, I didn't have to remove the distributer as the intake manifold was not obstructing it. I made sure to label my spark plug wires to the corresponding cylinder. Will TDC change even though I didn't remove the distributer?
• It has new spark plugs, fuel pump, spark plug wires and I've tried running it hours and even a day later in case it was flooded.

Any feed back would help please.

 

[mod5v]

Im not sure how you removed the cam without pulling the oil pump drive..but im sure that your timming is way off. pull the dist. turn engine over to #1 TDC compression stroke. with the cap off the dist reinstall it and where the rotor is pointing is your new #1 spark position. Better yet when your at TDC pull up the oilpump drive and reorientate it so that the slot puts your dist back at #1 wire.

 

[JBurch]

• Hi, I recently in stalled a new Cam with lifters, Pushrods and Aluminum Heads. Car was running prior to installing these new parts. Engine is cracking, but that's all its doing! also carburetor shots random fuel mist when I crank.
• Here's my question when I installed the timing chain I made sure the two dots lined up and piston 1# one was at top dead center. However the indicator line/Timer mark on the harmonic balancer was not aligned to the zero (0) mark on the plate tab. Was this also suppose to be aligned?
• Secondly, I didn't have to remove the distributer as the intake manifold was not obstructing it. I made sure to label my spark plug wires to the corresponding cylinder. Will TDC change even though I didn't remove the distributer?
• It has new spark plugs, fuel pump, spark plug wires and I've tried running it hours and even a day later in case it was flooded.

Any feed back would help please.

Don't worry about where #1 is cuz it won't be at TDC; put the crank gear at noon, put the cam gear at 6 o'clock then make sure you have intermediate shaft in correct position, put front cover, etc back on, now put balancer back on, put it at zero, install distributor, rotor at #1 , double check firing order, should run

 

[67Dart273]

^What do you mean "it won't be at TDC?"

There are 3 possibilities, (maybe 1832,000)

1. The cam may be timed wrong even though you "think." Is this a multi key advance/ retard drive set?

2....Rare but happened, you might have a reverse rotation marine cam

3....More likely the dist. is in wrong. REmove no1 plug, stick your finger in the hole and bump the engine until compression blows your finger out. Now watch for the marks and bring them up NOT at TDC but rather where you want the timing to be, IE sayt 15BTC or so

4....Check the dist. rotor is point to no1 plug wire tower. Adjust the body of the dist. so the points just open going CCW with the dist, or adjust so the pickup coil core is centered on the reluctor tooth

 

[AJ/FormS]

Like said, if you didn't pull the D out before the cam removal, then pulling the cam would have rotated the rotor to a new position. Then installing the replacement cam would not necessarily have rotated the rotor back to the proper orientation. I have never tried this and didn't even know it could be done.
Any way you just need to reset your timing, as others have said.

 

[nm9stheham]

OP, when you lined up the dots, was the crank sprocket dot at 12 o'clock and the cam sprocket dot at 6 o'clock? You need to use a straight edge to make sure the dots are truly aligned with the centers of the cam and crank.

The mark on the damper a should have been within a few degrees of the 0 mark if you put it on with the dots on the sprockets still aligned.

If the dots are aligned as above (crank dot at 12 and cam dot at 6), then both #1 and #6 cylinders are at TDC, but it is # 6 that will be firing with the dots aligned this way, NOT #1.

 

[oldkimmer]

Don't worry about where #1 is cuz it won't be at TDC; put the crank gear at noon, put the cam gear at 6 o'clock then make sure you have intermediate shaft in correct position, put front cover, etc back on, now put balancer back on, put it at zero, install distributor, rotor at #1 , double check firing order, should run

Then u are on number 6 compression as stated above. U need to turn the motor over 1 revolution or put the rotor pointing to number 6. The rotation is clockwise. Kim

 

[dano]

What rockers? Did you check your push rod length? I don't like "dot to dot", degreeing the cam to crank will get them in proper sink. Damper off a bit isn't uncommon but it might mean the outer hub is slipping.

 

[Rob38e]

Im not sure how you removed the cam without pulling the oil pump drive..but im sure that your timming is way off. pull the dist. turn engine over to #1 TDC compression stroke. with the cap off the dist reinstall it and where the rotor is pointing is your new #1 spark position. Better yet when your at TDC pull up the oilpump drive and reorientate it so that the slot puts your dist back at #1 wire.

Didn't know the oil pump drive had to come off, but the CAM came off easy and was also able to reinstall with no issues.

 

[Rob38e]

To answer a few questions; I did line the two crank dots at 12 and 6, but when I installed the harmonic the mark was not aligned with the damper. I figured since I had the 1# piston at TDC and both dots lined than that would be sufficient. Additionally as noted earlier the CAM came right out without any resistance and the distributer never came off. I'm also inclined to think that my timing is off. On a side note, the engine is in the vehicle and everything has been put back together. Is there a preferred method to checking for TDC (feel for pressure w/finger, TDC bolt). As far as lifter length, I utilized CompCam adjustable pushrod to measure the length from lifter to rocker.
*Should I take the distributer out and start from scratch or can I just find TDC and make sure the pointer is pointing to 1# plug.
Thank you all for you insight, I truly appreciate all you insight and knowledge.

 

[67Dart273]

There are only two easy ways to get TDC with no1 on compression. If the valve covers are off, bring the marks to TDC and look at no1 and no6 valves. Whichever set is closed, that cylinder will fire

The other is the "finger in the hole" "feel for compression"

If you think the timing mark on the balancer is off (it can happen) use a piston stop to determine. I've had this one I made since the middle seventies. Mine is not adjustable, was made specifically for SB Mopar

 

[nm9stheham]

To answer a few questions; I did line the two crank dots at 12 and 6, but when I installed the harmonic the mark was not aligned with the damper. I figured since I had the 1# piston at TDC and both dots lined than that would be sufficient. Additionally as noted earlier the CAM came right out without any resistance and the distributer never came off. I'm also inclined to think that my timing is off. On a side note, the engine is in the vehicle and everything has been put back together. Is there a preferred method to checking for TDC (feel for pressure w/finger, TDC bolt). As far as lifter length, I utilized CompCam adjustable pushrod to measure the length from lifter to rocker.
*Should I take the distributer out and start from scratch or can I just find TDC and make sure the pointer is pointing to 1# plug.
Thank you all for you insight, I truly appreciate all you insight and knowledge.

Hmmm! You found a new technique! LOL

You did the right thing by having the dots aligned and if the woodruff key was still in the crank and the crank sprocket is a 12 o'clock, then #1 & #6 HAVE to be at TDC. (The woodruff key WAS on the crank snout, right? Just checkin'....crazy stuph happens....)

As has been said, the distributor probably did not mesh back in with the cam in anywhere near the right timing. Since the damper mark is all messed up, use a piston stop (bolt) as noted above to accurately find TDC on #1. Put a new mark on the damper at the 0 mark on the timing cover for your 0 reference now.

NOW... since #1 reaches TDC twice per combustion cycle, you have to figure out which TDC event it is. This is simple to do: Remove the valve cover over #1 and look at the valves. If both #1 valves are slightly open as you rotate the engine back and forth past this TDC point, then you are at #1 TDC on the valve overlap, not #1 firing. In that case, line up the distributor rotor with #6. If both #1 valves are solidly closed, then line the rotor up with #1. You can move the wires around and then adjust the distributor position for firing, but keep the vacuum advance canister away from the firewall so it does not hit.

As for the damper, either:

• This is a pre-1970 damper with a '71 timing cover, or a 1970-or-later damper with a pre-'70 timing cover. On which side are your timing marks on the timing cover? Driver's side is 1970 and later.
• Or, the ring on the damper has slipped as noted.

How far was your damper mark from the 0 mark on the timing cover when you put the damper on? If it a year mismatch of damper and timing cover, then they will be almost 90 degrees off.

If it not near 90* off, then the ring has very likely slipped. This is a serious situation, as the ring can eventually fly off and do lots of damage. A new damper IS in order if the ring has slipped.

And be aware that the crank bolt for the damper needs to be torqued to 135 ft lbs for the damper to do its job of 'damping'.

 

[67Dart273]

Let's take a breath for a second, some "juz' sayin" here.........

Balancers DO slip. And there's the issue of an early timing cover vs late balancer. BUT THIS IS RARE

The OP changed the cam in the car? Leaning down in the bay, it can be difficult to be sure the cam marks are aligned, without care and a straightedge

Having the distributor drive gear out of place only changes the distributor........easily "fixed" by rotating the plug wires, or walking the gear up a tooth or two with a screwdriver.

The bottom line, if you can not get the thing to run after verifying the balancer timing mark is correct (piston stop) and that the ignition timing is right with the marks, then the cam HAS to be out of time

 

[AJ/FormS]

The easy way, after the rotor is reasonably close; is to just advance the timing as the engine is cranking, until it springs to life. If it kicks back, just retard it a smidge.
Your start-timing window while already cranking is huge; from about 5* retarded (with extra throttle opening), to about 25*advanced, or even a tad more. Huge I tell ya. And it will idle at those numbers too. But after it fires and runs, you can re-position the D to where ever it likes to be. Just don't go WOT, until you get it set more accurately.

 

[MOPAROFFICIAL]

I've had this one I made since the middle seventies. Mine is not adjustable, was made specifically for SB Mopar View attachment 1715316962

Specifically for that motor/piston combo would be accurate.

 

[67Dart273]

Specifically for that motor/piston combo would be accurate.

The pistons don't matter. It does not need to be a specific length, and actually the further down in the bore within reason, the more accurate it is, because as the crank comes "up and over" there's a period where rate of change slows down.