help and suggestions 440 build...

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69dodgedart360

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Hey everybody just looking for some help on a build. I am aiming to run mid-low 11's, be able to run on 91 octane and be able to drive on the street but the car probably will not or very rarely see a freeway and see the track more because that is what it primarily will be used for,racing. this is what i have so far...
1969 Dodge Dart all steel fiberglass hood (gutted interior)
69 440 bored .040
stock stroke forged crank
stock rods with flat top pistons
edelbrock performer intake
850 Barry Grant
As far as the cam goes i was thinking hydraulic roller maybe this one:
Comp Cams XR286HR-10
Now, i do have a set of '69 906 heads that probably just need a valve job and i can throw them on if i keep the cam conservative because of the valve springs or i could just buy the heads from 440source for $900 and run those along with a bigger cam. i kinda am leaning towards what i have but for the price it makes me just want to spend the extra cash for the aluminum and not skimp.
Schumacher headers
i am going to be running 3.91 gears in an 8 3/4 w/ subframe connectors and a freshly rebuilt 727 w/ a convertor that stalls in the area of 3000 and a 26.6 inch tire (until i mini tub) i will run ET Streets regardless

sorry for writing so much but there are a lot of smart ppl on this board who have probably done this before. im only 19 so this would be my first shot at a drag car and want to beat my brothers 383 Nova :) Thanks
 
The 440 source heads won't help you much with the cam and the intake manifold that your useing, let alone the rear gears. With heads as large as the 440 sources heads you will have to run a higher stall converter and a much better intake manifold and more rear gears, something like 4.88's, a Victor intake and a 4500 + converter.
 
so a victor intake shorter gears, spool? a way higher stall and different cam what cam would you suggest to go along with my 906 heads if i get minimal head work done (porting),i know i have a set of 4.56's. but no convertor Dynamic?
thank you
P.S. should i spend the extra cash and buy new pistons and rods?
 
I would use a cam something like the Mopar .590 or the equal from another manufacturer, these have always shown good performance in the 440's. Unless the rods and pistons won't take the abuse that would be the only reason that I would change them.
 
It's not hard. What pistons are they? Have you started the rebuilding process yet? You don't need a roller, or solid to run those numbers in an A body.
 
But a hyd. roller isn't going to perform like a full race roller, but I agree that he should be able to get there without a roller or a solid lifter cam. Alot has to do with how the car is setup.
 
ya thats the thing i have no idea what pistons they are! all i can find is a number that says B218 stamped on the inside of all the pistons and thats it. i assume they are orignal cast flat top pistons. but i have been thinking of just buying the KB hypreutectic ones because i know what i will have compression wise for sure and they are probably better than what i have now.if i were to run hoosier quick time pros along w/ 4.56's and had a decent launch and traction with my above combo any idea what i will be at? Anyone heard of a similar build and ran it at the strip?
P.S. is the MP 590 a solid cam?
 
Yes the MP .590 is a solid lifter cam. I ran a low deck version of this and I run alcohol on it and it ran 7.07 @ 102 1/8 mi. 2865 lbs. 74 Dart Swinger. The one in the Avatar.
 
If you look inside the underside of the piston...above where the pin is (closer to the bottom of the dome)... Is there a steel plate attached to the piston's sides? If yes, factory piston. If no, prob aftermarket stock replacement. If you are planning to race the car, I would suggest a good forged piston, like Diamonds or a set of the Keith Black KB836s. Diamonds are about $180 more than the KBs, but are a better piston. You could run KB hypers too, however if this is predominantly a race car, better pistons will last longer and be stronger for future growth. I would use RPM heads, again, because there is room to grow, and they have a better chamber that I like to utilize. I am not a fan of the Stealth heads yet. 4.56s and a 28" tall tire will put you in the upper reaches of 6500 in the traps and you'll need air flow. You can run 906s stock, port the 906s, or upgrade. I'd upgrade to RPMs properly set up. The 906s will need some work to be usable, and the chamber is still huge and inefficient. A set of RPMs, and a Comp XE285HL, an M1 single plane, and a good convertor, and you're done with plenty of room to grow.
 
the game has changed, i have plans to put the 440 in a Duster now that is already tubbed. i got the car and am thinking i could make the car a quarter mile killer but still be able to drive it on the street. I checked out the pistons i honestly think they are federal mogul cast replacement pistons, but i have been thinking about buying the Speed Pro forged ones since they are pretty cheap ($300) and running the stock rods. getting traction is not going to be that difficult since the car is already tubbed w/ SS springs and subframes already on the car so thats a plus. And i might even get the hydraulic roller. Has anyone ever had problems getting oil up ot the valvetrain or had problems with a hydraulic roller? I am only asking becasue my cousin has a hydraulic roller in his car and for some reason not enough oil is getting through the valvetrain (the lifters?). Would my combo be better balanced with 3.91's or maybe 4.10's w/ a 9.5" Dynamic converter now that i can throw in a pair of racing slicks?
 
I would lose the hydraulic roller cam idea and invest in some real pistons. You can build a very strong engine with a decent hydraulic or solid flat tappet now-a-days. If this is a race car, put gears in that place the engine at 6000 thru the traps. If you have tubs, not minitubs, you have big meats. If it's minitubs, go with the largest diameter tire you can fit. You get more traction with taller, then you do with wider. And taller allows for more gearing. I'd be looking at 4.30s with a set of 29" tires.
 
yeah this thing definately has tubs the hugest tires i have ever seen (in person at least). Could you point me in the direction of a good Hydraulic Flat tappet Cam? is 550hp unrealistic for a stock stroke 440 with gasket matched and bowl ported 906 heads and a hydraulic cam?
 
550 IMO is unrealistic with almost any 906 or factory iron head... With a good stage 2 or 3 porting it might make that much, but you'd make more power with better heads, and spend the same or slightly more, plus loose the weight and be able to use quench to your advantage. However, honestly, you dont want 550hp, you want 550 pound feet of torque. And that might be a challenge with 906s. I think I would say get a set of KB822 which are a stock pin, 4.365 (+.040) forged flat top. I'd run it at zero deck. Get a set of Stealth heads and have them corrected, chambers reduced to 84ccs, and the springs, retainers, and locks replaced with ones that match the cam. Use the Fel Pro Performance 1009 gasket to avoid the chamber overhang with the Stealth heads. This gives you a 10.25:1 engine with .040 quench. With a modern hydraulic in the 240°@.050 area that should make close to 530 pound feet below 4000rpm, and carry the power to past 6000rpm peaking around 500. You can make more torque and horsepower with a solid flat tappet of that size too. Much more with some tweaking and a solid in the 250°@.050 range. Some sintered iron rockers and you can expect lower rpm peaks and more overall power. It may end up several hundred dollars more, but you'll have more performance, and more potential for that investment now.
 
69dodgedart360 said:
Has anyone ever had problems getting oil up ot the valvetrain or had problems with a hydraulic roller? I am only asking becasue my cousin has a hydraulic roller in his car and for some reason not enough oil is getting through the valvetrain (the lifters?).
Click to expand...

Hydraulic roller lifters tend to be taller then flat tappet lifters and some times at max lift the lifter oil groove can be exposed out of the lifter bore allowing excessive oil pressure to bleed off. Tell your cousin to pull his intake, run the oil pump with a drill and a priming rod, and turn the engine and watch the lifters to see if oil squirts out.
 
how much of a power difference would there be between a solid flat tappet to a hydraulic flat tappet cam? it seems that a solid will make more power but i really dont feel like adjusting the valves every so often but if it will make more power it kinda is making me side with it but i was also told that a solid cam will not last too long on the street and is mainly for all out performance which is pushing me towards the hydraulic because i dont feel like changing cams every couple of years. How often do Solid cams last? are they just as reliable to a hydraulic? the car will see street use aka stoplight to stoplight driving and maybe the freeway to get to a meet or something but i do want the combination to lead me to my goal with ease and i just want to pick the right one.
 
The difference in hydraulic flat tappet and solid falt tappet is rate of lift. And the reason for that is the lifter design. By making the lifter automatically adjust lash, you sacrifice the ability to open the valves faster. The faster you open, the longer they are open over the same total lift. The oil dampens the lifter's ability to accelerate the valve open. As the cams get bigger and spring rates rise, the effects of the sponginess get worse. You need air in and out to make power. So being really simplified, a solid cam will get more air in for any given size than a hydraulic. You do need to set and maintain lash. But if the engine is built right, this is a once a year deal if that. The basic idea is, you need mroe rpms to make the power with a hydraulic, and that is a finite level where you really can't make more due to the lifter design. Hydraulic rollers BTW suffer from the same issue, which is why I don't bother with them. You will make more torque from a solid than a hydraulic of identical size, and you'll make it at a lower rpm every time.
 
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