Should I change my cam?!

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I appreciate the input guys, however, I think I'm gonna leave the cam in and see how it does. It won't be hard to change later if I need too.

Also, I've heard a lot of talk about how you can't run a cam like that with 9:1+ compression. Too much cylinder pressure, the world's gonna end, etc.. The iron headed 360 in my dart is an actual 9.3:1 motor with a 222/226 cam in it, and it runs like a scalded dog! I had people on this forum tell me it wouldn't work when I was putting it together, but it works great! I know math is math, but damn. I'll take experience over a calculator any day!
 
Similar application......

Lil Red Express, 9.5:1 340, mild blended 587’s with 2.02’s, std Performer, 650 Holley, headers, 11” TA, 3.55’s.
Nice and snappy for a driver.
Used the Comp 268H.

378tq/343hp.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Have you used this particular cam in an engine just like his?
More likely that is a 110 LSA cam. Then
(268+272)/2 less (2x110)= 50 overlap
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not in a 318, not with 3.23s, and not with an automatic,with a 2200TC, and not at 9.1Scr.
but I ran a similar cam; a
Hughes HE2430AL; 223/230/110/ .538/.549 lift at 1.6rockers; Years later published as 270/276/110/53 overlap;
that's pretty close right?

At 3650 pounds, it went it went an easy [email protected], on 245/60-14s, shifting at 7000;on it's first and only run.
Scalded dog is an understatement;
It would smoke 245s at will, and it took 295s to tame it, which would still bust loose at 50/55, in second gear, just with a foot-stomp.

But;I ran it;
in a 367,with a manual trans,and 3.55s. At~180psi cylinder pressure ~11/1 Scr,
 
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AJ/FormS said:
not in a 318, not with 3.23s, and not with an automatic,with a 2200TC, and not at 9.1Scr.
but I ran a similar cam; a
Hughes HE2430AL; 223/230/110/ .538/.549 lift at 1.6rockers; Years later published as 270/276/110/53 overlap;
that's pretty close right?

At 3650 pounds, it went it went an easy [email protected], on 245/60-14s, shifting at 7000;on it's first and only run.
Scalded dog is an understatement;
It would smoke 245s at will, and it took 295s to tame it, which would still bust loose at 50/55, in second gear, just with a foot-stomp.

But;I ran it;
in a 367,with a manual trans,and 3.55s. At~180psi cylinder pressure ~11/1 Scr,
Click to expand...

Then your answer is no. Then you have no way other than your books and figures to know whether it will run well "for him".
 
Well I once put a 340 cam into a 69 318, together with the rest of the 340 topend;does that count?
And another time I put the samejunk on a smogger teen, does that count?
I've done all kinds of weird stuff since the late 60s, cuz as broke-azz kids,that was all we had.
A guy only has to put the same junk together once or maybe twice, to know not to do it again.
OP's gonna find out pretty quick, and he's likely gonna put one of us on ignore. I learned the hard way too.
When I really started learning, I was doing Dcrs long-hand with a hand-held calculator.Cuz I was sure a 9.1 engine was sucked out before I even put the performance cam into it. And when I started recommending 11/1Scr and more, I got the stink-eye. Now everybody builds 11/1,... and higher. But I run mine on skunk-piss 87E10, with full-timing, with street gears and a clutch...... because my calculator said it would work...... and it did. I'm not afraid to trychit,even backing up and trying again; but I ain't interested in going backwards.
 
Hey AJ, no offense or disrespect, but it's not the information, but how it's presented. It's obvious that you're experienced and very knowledgeable. And I don't think people question that.

It's the forever long response that you tend to post, and what some may perceive to be an arrogant "know it all" under tone.

Maybe try and presenting your knowledge in a different, and simpler format. Instead of an essay full of calculations, maybe trim it down to a simpler "I think that cam will bleed off to much cylinder pressure" type answer. I believe it will be better received.

Like I said, just an observation. No insult intended.
 
I feel that you should step back one cam size.
But if you are going to us that cam and want to prove the point that have been put to you.
Install straight out(USING A DEGREE WHEEL AND A DIAL INDICATOR)

Then advance it 5 or 6 degrees. If it give you more bottom end but, hurts your freeway mileage. then buy the smaller cam.

Personally I think it will work find. ONLY because you live close to sea level.

I have that same cam it a 360 4x4. 3.55 gears and 31x10.50x15 and it is a DOG!!!! why? First and foremost, i live at 6600 foot elevation.
2nt i was DUMB ENOUGH, to pay actual money, to have a "Low Stall" converter built for in:rolleyes:. (trying to get better mileage out of it.)
It runs fin down the road and even pulling a trailer. But it will NOT get out of its own way below 20 mph.

It has good power, But a stock 200,000 mile 318 would kick it's *** on the street every day of its life.
 
vntned said:
Hey AJ, no offense or disrespect, but it's not the information, but how it's presented. It's obvious that you're experienced and very knowledgeable. And I don't think people question that.

It's the forever long response that you tend to post, and what some may perceive to be an arrogant "know it all" under tone.

Maybe try and presenting your knowledge in a different, and simpler format. Instead of an essay full of calculations, maybe trim it down to a simpler "I think that cam will bleed off to much cylinder pressure" type answer. I believe it will be better received.

Like I said, just an observation. No insult intended.
Click to expand...

The thing is, that your asking him to be someone else, and he will never be that person.
I have never felt that his post were Arrogant.
Some time i have had to read his post several time, to understand the hole story.
But i like it better then someone how is tired of give out a answer. And give the short answer.....to small, to big, run it.

I'm not poking at you vntned, nor am i trying to speak for AJ
Just my observation.
 
If you own the cam and can return or sell it do so
If you own it and can't return it install the way cuda said above
a d check the intake close point at .004 and .006 and .008 cam lift run a compression check
if you then find it is like cuda said and you need converter and gears to "fix" you just have the wrong cam
you know where your intake close point is with that am advanced and can estimate how far you have to move it shorten it) to get the power where YOU want it
ps it's easy to shorten a big cam with a regrind. and reface the lifters if you are on a budget
sometimes without even changing pushrods
 
This post is not to the OP.
My first response was gentle;
AJ/FormS said:
275/60-15s are `28 tall or 88" roll-out
With the 3.23s and a 2.45 low gear, those conspire to make 60mph =6000rpm@5% slip, at the top of first gear;therefore 30@3000
Having already run this cam,the P4452761, with a probable cylinder pressure of 145psi, just ask yourself; "were you happy with the performance".
If the answer is yes, then leave it in there.
Click to expand...
Then I moved to an opinion
Would I run it?
not with 3.23s and a 2200.
and not with 145psi.
Click to expand...

Then I offered my experience, and alternatives
I have an 84D100 with a smogger-teen, also at 145psi. But I run 3.55s and a 2.74 low gear with a 2800TC; no cam and just a 4bbl/dual exhaust. Oh yeah, with 275/50-15s it burns rubber all thru first.
The 2800 lets the engine spool up to where the torque peak is. The 9.73 starter gear multiplies the meager torque the smogger teen makes, and the ThermoQuad-4bbl rolls in enough power,once it opens, to keep the engine spooled up, and the tires spinning. That's how it makes fun.
Your starter is only 7.91, but because of your tall tire28 versus my 25.8s that steals another 8% off your TM. This makes your corrected starter to be 6.78 versus my corrected of 8.75, giving me 29% more TM.
My engine is spooled up at 2800, versus yours at 2200. I'm guessing that will make close to 100 ftlbs difference.
So at zero mph, and WOT you might be 100x1.29=129 ftlbs behind my smogger-teen. You'll never catch my smogger teen in first gear.
To put that into perspective, at 2200 your 268 cam will be 1.29x2200/5250=54hp down on my smogger.
Or lets say your 9.0/268* engine makes 150 ftlbs at 2200. This is 150x6.78=1017 ftlbs to the road
and say my smogger 8.0/240* cam makes 250@2800; making 250x7.91=1978 ftlbs to the road.
You see the difference there?
I'm just spitballing numbers. The accuracy is not important, the thing that counts is the difference in ftlbs to the road.
In my experience, you need a minimum of 1600 corrected ftlbs to the road to initiate a two fat tires spinning. And about 2000 to sustain it, long enough for the engine to get up on the cam. At your corrected number of 1017, you got a long way to go. You would need 5.38s with that 2200, or perhaps a 3200/3500TC with the 3.23s or simply put; more engine torque.
Given your "no other changes allowed"; the only other choice is a cam with an earlier closing intake, to make more pressure.
Click to expand...

Then I restated the earlier conclusion
So I repeat;if you have already run this cam, and were happy with it, then leave it alone.
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This was to the OP, as kindly as I know how to be.
My answer is always in the first paragraph or two, with additional data following. Because I have seen too many instances where the original poster comes back and has more question and then the thread goes to 4 pages... and more. So in the interest of thoroughness, I try to foresee those questions, and get them answered in the same post.
Generally the OPs have longer attention spans than some naysayers here. Generally the OPs are looking for advice, opinions, and reinforcement, cuz a lotof the time they have already have a game-plan in mind, or they just don't know; we all gotta start somewhere, and there are multiple ways of learning. So I try to cover the bases.
Then allhell broke loose.
You all know this is a crap-combo, but you just can't back out of the corner you painted yourselves into, so instead of owning up, you attempt to make me the fall guy. That's pack-mentality. That's high-schoolchit.
In any case, you naysayers don't have to read past the first paragraph; my advice was not for you.
My apology to the OP; you asked for advice but ended in confusion. Do what you think is best, and let the forum know how it works out, maybe I'll learn something for next time.
 
Merry Christmas AJ
your posts always show careful analysis and where you get good inputs you get good outputs
I appreciated how you (now) convert mopar .008 to whatever your sim uses- You showed that it does make a difference
Do try the controlled induction package sometime
 
Ok, how about this cam? Better match for the rest of my build?

CCA-CL20-222-3

Hydraulic flat tappet

Basic Operating RPM Range:1,300-5,600

Duration at 050 inch Lift:218 int./224 exh.

Advertised Duration:262 int./270 exh.

Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.462 int./0.470 exh.

Lobe Separation (degrees):110

Grind Number:CRS XE262H-10
 
no
yet another SBC grind
would be the better than the xe268
same cam series
you can check the comp website and find the intake closed point on their cams
but any of the 256 duration cams from Howard, Lunati voodoo or jones will have more area where it counts and close the intake earlier than the 256 comp cam
as I said comp as nothing under 275 that is optimized for a mopar
 
Funny, I talked to the guys at CompCams for awhile on the phone and described my entire build. They actually recommended that XE262 grind...
 
Looks fine to me.

But I’m one of those people who is perfectly happy running a cam that doesn’t require the use a .904 lifter in a Mopar.

I like having the option of using all the available lobe families in a build....... instead of just the 3 or 4 .904 specific choices.

That XE262 has been used in tons of good running non-Mopar motors for years.
Why wouldn’t it work just as well in a Mopar?

My one word of caution is...... with what you get for hyd lifters these days....... fast rate hyd cams can tend to be a little noisy.

I also think the 701 VooDoo would be a good fit.
 
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comp guy is selling what he has on the shelf not what's best for you
voodoo would be better
compare the specs yourself
xe262 would work but you give up torque
 
Freakin A brother, freakin A!
PRH said:
Looks fine to me.

But I’m one of those people who is perfectly happy running a cam that doesn’t require the use a .904 lifter in a Mopar.

I like having the option of using all the available lobe families in a build....... instead of just the 3 or 4 .904 specific choices.

That XE262 has been used in tons of good running non-Mopar motors for years.
Why wouldn’t it work just as well in a Mopar?

My one word of caution is...... with what you get for hyd lifters these days....... fast rate hyd cams can tend to be a little noisy.

I also think the 701 VooDoo would be a good fit.
Click to expand...
 
there is a place for budget cams, but you have to watch out for high priced wanna bees and you do give up torque. you have to add duration to get the same hp with a .842 grind with all that implies
 
PRH said:
Looks fine to me.

But I’m one of those people who is perfectly happy running a cam that doesn’t require the use a .904 lifter in a Mopar.

I like having the option of using all the available lobe families in a build....... instead of just the 3 or 4 .904 specific choices.

That XE262 has been used in tons of good running non-Mopar motors for years.
Why wouldn’t it work just as well in a Mopar?

My one word of caution is...... with what you get for hyd lifters these days....... fast rate hyd cams can tend to be a little noisy.

I also think the 701 VooDoo would be a good fit.
Click to expand...
I know the differences have been shown between lobes designed for .842” and ..904” on the dyno, and many make statements about what you’re giving up, but what about direct comparisons on the street and track. I’ve only read of many stating one would never know the difference, or not much, insignificant seat of pants. Ive never seen time slips comparing a Chevy cam in a Mopar vs. a real Mopar cam all else the same.I’d like to see real world input that show this.
 
Actually I find more difference on the street than in brackets.
We spent a lot of time both dyno and road on combinations for the 440 motorhome
There is a reason that Nascar limited to ford size lifters- no one ran chevy lifters
check the Hughes website
also comp has a comparison of their XE and XE-HL cams
definitely you can feel the difference at the same seat timing
In a heads up class the .904 or a mushroom cam will win
 
One thing I’d like to know or have explained to me and maybe others may find of interest is: when does a lobe become a lobe designed for a .904” lifter? What specs determine? One or any combination? Is a lobe one is looking at a fast .842” or a slow .875” or .904” etc? Take away the .842”, .875”, and .904” notations saying it is such, and just look at the adv, .050”, .100, .200”, .300” durations, the lobe lift and if you’re lucky you have specs for .020” etc. I’m looking at a lot of lobes for all size lifters and I see some very aggressive .875” and .842” where the numbers look mighty close to some that are for .904” Slap on a set of 1.6 or 1.7’s and like others have said, have more lobes to choose from. Granted, more complex than just looking at a few numbers in a listing but where’s the dividing line? Just a curiosity of mine.
 
I'm flabbergasted that they have you thinking of changing cams. Not surprised though. It figures.
 
Since there seems to be conflicting info on exactly what the OP’s current cam would measure/spec ......I’d be checking it myself so I knew what I actually had....... then decide if it makes sense for the application or not.
 
PRH said:
Since there seems to be conflicting info on exactly what the OP’s current cam would measure/spec ......I’d be checking it myself so I knew what I actually had....... then decide if it makes sense for the application or not.
Click to expand...

Probably the best post so far. I must admit, even I would steer clear of an MP camshafts now. I would have to see it on a wheel before I would ever consider running one.
 
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