Timing chain oil slinger

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rustyswinger

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Good afternoon FABO braintrust.

I have stripped down the front end of my 74' 318 to change the timing cover. ( which is cracked and leaking a bit)

My intent is to install a double roller timing sprocket and chain set that I purchased from Rock Auto. ( Its a cheapo set... I know, I am not sure this engine is my long term choice so I am going to gamble on this timing set)

My Question.
Will I have issues with my oil slinger fitting on the double roller set? The timing chain in there now is not the original teflon coated cam gear.... it is a solid steel set up, with a single roller chain

The Timing cover I am going to install is an OEM cover that I have cleaned, inspected and pressed in a new seal into.

Who ever replaced this timing set in my engine, removed the little deflector that drips the oil directly on to the sprocket/chain.
also...

I have a replacement deflector, will it fit with the double roller set up?



Thanks in advance!
 
The offset goes toward the crank gear. The slinger doesn't touch the chain.
 
oil slinger.JPG
 
rustyswinger said:
I was worried the extra width of the chain and sprockets would interfere and I needed to replace either the slinger or the cover with aftermarket gear.
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Nope, they will both fit, I used them on my 74 318 when I swapped out the cam and installed a double roller chain.
 
No problems. Since you have the oil slinger, use it. If not, I wouldn't worry about it. With the new technology in oil seal construction a slinger isn't a necessity.
 
Put in the timing cover bolts, but not too tight so the cover can move a bit. Then install the damper so it goes through the oil seal and move the cover to get the seal centered as good as it can on the damper hub; then tighten the cover bolts.
 
72Dart6pack said:
Go with a chain tensioner. Just a thought?

View attachment 1715264008
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I used a melling tensioner on my 5.9 magnum. Had about 1,000 miles on it when I tore it apart for a cam swap. The chain dug into the guides and sent bits of plastic through the engine. The crank journals were fine but the soft bearings were pretty trashed. I'll get pics when I get home later.
 
1994redram said:
I used a melling tensioner on my 5.9 magnum. Had about 1,000 miles on it when I tore it apart for a cam swap. The chain dug into the guides and sent bits of plastic through the engine. The crank journals were fine but the soft bearings were pretty trashed. I'll get pics when I get home later.
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I was wondering about that. A quality double roller shouldn't stretch too much especially how few miles we drive our cars. I put one in my 273 and wondered about it.
 
nm9stheham said:
Put in the timing cover bolts, but not too tight so the cover can move a bit. Then install the damper so it goes through the oil seal and move the cover to get the seal centered as good as it can on the damper hub; then tighten the cover bolts.
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And to add to that, put a thin layer of grease on the seal where it contacts the crank snout, so it isn't dry on start up.
 
And the tensioner will not fix any retard of the cam with chain stretch. It can only stabilize timing 'bounce' in some circumstances.

I've seen much better made tensioners and guides than the standard recent ones on the Mopar V engines. So I think I will refrain...
 
1994redram said:
I used a melling tensioner on my 5.9 magnum. Had about 1,000 miles on it when I tore it apart for a cam swap. The chain dug into the guides and sent bits of plastic through the engine. The crank journals were fine but the soft bearings were pretty trashed. I'll get pics when I get home later.
Click to expand...

I have a tensioner on my 340. Had to pull the cover after 10k for a leak and no wear. Running a Cloyes timing chain. Had to pull the cover and replace it at 18k and again no wear. Maybe I got lucky. Have heard of this happening before.

Fred B
 
1994redram said:
I used a melling tensioner on my 5.9 magnum. Had about 1,000 miles on it when I tore it apart for a cam swap. The chain dug into the guides and sent bits of plastic through the engine. The crank journals were fine but the soft bearings were pretty trashed. I'll get pics when I get home later.
Click to expand...
Like I said before, the tensioner was made for a silent chain, not a roller with its triple row of raised links. Your mileage may vary on if it chews the nylon. I cant really see how it does that unless its not oiled.
 
Almost sounds like the material varies. I would not be surprised if the factory used one type and the replacement parts makers use something different.

I've worked on 3 engines that I used for racing that had good guides and tensioners with double roller chains, not silent chains:
Mitsu 1.6L and 2.6L and Opel 1.9L. All lasted well..... but the 2.6 and 1.9 used oil pressure tensioners, not simple spring tensioners, and all made much better provisions for directly oiling the chains than the LA design.
 
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I do have a double row timing chain. That's what was on my magnum when I tore it down. So I replaced it with a good quality double row timing chain and put the tensioner on it. I don't think it's necessary anyways, just thought it was a nice and cheap upgrade! Ended up costing some money for new bearings and gaskets.

20181220_193044.jpg
20181220_193036.jpg
 
The high spots on the big chain are putting 3 or 4 times the design pressure on that plastic. It is no wonder it got hot and pretty much melted away (or just ground away) at the small points of contact.
 
That is pretty worn looking redram. I'd see similar or less grooving in the tensioner surface than that when tearing down 100+ kmile Opel engines. Something is not compatible there. Again, a double row roller chain was stock....
 
To the best of my knowledge, the timing chain to be used with the late Mopar tensioner is a flat, link-belt chain. The load would be spread evenly across the plastic runner.
Chrysler-Dodge-273-318-340-360-SA-Gear.jpg

Someone might make a special tensioner for use with the double-roller chain. I do not know.
 
69_340_GTS said:
To the best of my knowledge, the timing chain to be used with the late Mopar tensioner is a flat, link-belt chain. The load would be spread evenly across the plastic runner.View attachment 1715264648
Someone might make a special tensioner for use with the double-roller chain. I do not know.
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The tensioners used now are from Magnum engines.
 
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1994redram said:
I do have a double row timing chain. That's what was on my magnum when I tore it down. So I replaced it with a good quality double row timing chain and put the tensioner on it. I don't think it's necessary anyways, just thought it was a nice and cheap upgrade! Ended up costing some money for new bearings and gaskets.

View attachment 1715264557 View attachment 1715264558
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Thats gnarly! How does a round link tear up nylon like that?
 
The oil slinger will work fine with a double row chain set. However, I would not run the "el cheapo" set in anything at ALL. Those cheap sets have split rollers. Look at the rollers in your chain and you will see they are split. These are weaker than a factory single row, even with the nylon quiet camshaft gear. You should upgrade at LEAST to the cheapest solid roller design out there. They are not that expensive.
 
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