What the hell is going on with shops?

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My 4t65HD was $2800 (good buddy prices), but it is built to handle the modified supercharged 3.8. It has all the good bits and a LSD, don't ever want to mess with it again. $1100? Wallet rape artists
 
WAIT, what year dodge ram.... This is insane to be getting this far along you guys aren't sure what trans it is, the 545, the 68, the 8hp4, 8hp7 WHICH TRANS EXACTLY....

$1100 may be high, but $300 and you'll be done in no time....

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65_valiant said:
It sounds as if the guy went in and asked what a specific repair would cost. If he were to ask you for the same, would you automatically include diagnostics, or would you offer the diagnostics as an option? And if declined, do what the customer asked of you. Minus your warrantee of course, I wouldn't offer a warrantee on the job if it was based off of someone elses diagnostics.I've taken a vehicle in for a blown exhaust donut before. told them it was leaking, and when I went to pick it up they said they couldnt hear anything and here's our bill for checking. Didnt even replace the damned donut and STILL wanted 85 bucks.
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This is exactly the case. ^
We have, and know how to use the Snap on diagnostic computer and the code said it was the OD lockup solinoid failure.
Trans is a 46RE and the solinoid is accesible with the pan off.
We found the solinoid (aftermarket unit) $60 and he asked the shop what it would cost to drop the pan and put the customer supplied solinoid in.

So basically it is a trans service and swap out the solinoid while the pan is off.
No diagnosis needed, and of course no warantee expected for the part or if the part didn't fix the problem.
 
as the owner of a shop ( boat repair ) there is nothing that irritates me more than a customer showing up at my shop having already diagnosed problem with part in his hand asking " how much to put this in ? " I have givin crazy prices to get rid of them . The reason is because if their diagnosis is wrong or part fails ? who is customer gonna come snivel at ? me . I am not taking the side of the shop you went to because that price was ludicris . I am just saying ...... You dont bring your own steak to a resturaunt and ask them how much to cook medium rare .
 
DFootCuda said:
as the owner of a shop ( boat repair ) there is nothing that irritates me more than a customer showing up at my shop having already diagnosed problem with part in his hand asking " how much to put this in ? " I have givin crazy prices to get rid of them . The reason is because if their diagnosis is wrong or part fails ? who is customer gonna come snivel at ? me . I am not taking the side of the shop you went to because that price was ludicris . I am just saying ...... You dont bring your own steak to a resturaunt and ask them how much to cook medium rare .
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I actually agree with you completely, and have sent people packing with an outrageous price to get rid of them myself.
My main point in brining this up in the first place was not to ***** about the estimate so much, but help other to know if something isn't quite right.
We have no problem diagnosing and doing the trans repair ourselves.
The market out there is what it is because people pay it, just like a new oem tail light for a 68 GTS can cost you 250 bucks. (because others have paid that for them) and therefore set the cost for that part from then on.
I also realize that it pisses off the shops when someone says that they are charging or would charge too much.
Like I said earlier, I see people getting ripped off ALL the time on this board and it annoys me that they pay the bill instead of standing up for themselves and expecting quality work in trade for quality money.

On a side note, I keep the pictures members post of messed up work done and paid for as an example of unacceptable garbage.

Like this example.
This person paid to have his rear hangars relocated.
I would kick someones *** for doing this to my car.
 

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the sad thing is that when people over pay for stuff it sets the market and we all pay . I would be suprised if the person who relocated those hangars isn't the proud owner of an " *** hat " .
 
Lonewolf3165 said:
Well there ya go! Like I said in my post I think $1100 sounds high. I can't see it costing that much by itself unless there was other recommendations made along with it. However, if you think there is any profit left in your estimate of $350 you are mistaken. I do the math & come up with $92/ hr labor rate(which may be fair in some areas as it varies). That's not counting diagnosis-1.0hrs minimum which is more involved than a simple scan of the codes. Direct testing of the solenoid itself would only be prudent. Also what about gasket, fluid, & filter? Fluid alone is $9.00/ qt. X 4 or 5 qts. plus disposal fees(oh yes the EPA is on your *** to make sure everything get disposed of correctly or face fines). So really the estimate falls more in line with the one Mopar to ya posted @ $500-$550. My point is a PROFESSIONAL JOB that comes with a guarantee costs more that what you might spend if you trusted the kid at autozone to scan your car & give you his worthess advice based on 0 experience, then wasted a weekend afternoon lying on your back with **** dripping all over yourself to change that 1 bolt little solenoid. And if it dosen't fix it? Where do you go then? Autozone aint gonna take it back! They sure as hell aint gonna stand behind their eh hmm diagnosis!:pukerigh: So a shop that provides a service in a professional manner needs to make a profit & yes the customer will benefit more because of it. Not all shops are honest, but the vast majority aren't the crooked thieves that people- escpecially the do it yourselfers paint them out to be. Some are much more acurate & thorough in their diagnosis & expertise than others & although it may cost a little more for a given service or repair performed, a good technician & shop will save the customer more money in the long term. And for as many posts here & on other sites bashing shops & crying "rip-off" there are thousands other posters who trusted the wrong advice of a buddy or the guy behind the parts counter or thought they knew what they were doing & screwed the car up or have thrown countless parts at it guessing & are no better off than when they started! All because it was too much to pay a professional.
A lot of guys here want to paint all of us shop owners & technicians with the same broad brush as crooked evil doers & that's simply not true.
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You hit it ! Been there done that, I closed my shop up in 2009, because of the so called do it your selfers. Bring vehicle in along with parts, then want me to negociate (sp) my labor ect. I was a dealer tech for several years and invested in thousands of dollars in shop equipment along with constantly keeping up with the nescessary updates and additional training, all part of keeping up with the constant changes. Do I miss it? No to much aggravation. I often would stand and listen to the customer tell me what is wrong with their vehicle and offer my services. Then it would fall on deaf ears, so I would say why are you here waisting my and your time, if you know so much than fix it yourself. I treated my customers fairly, honestly and only did what was required or recommended. Now I run into past customer's asking me when I'm going to open another shop, I just laugh and say nope, not going to happen. Their response, well there isn't any good shops around and I keep getting ripped off. I say I'm sorry to hear that and go on my way. To bad when there are honest hard working shop owner's that are for the customer we are throwed into the same as the bad shops. I never did any advertising, all by referrals. Closed up and never looked back. I have other's who are still in the buisiness and when I stop in from time to time, they are the most unhappy, miserable, SOB'S. Most enjoyed their work but no longer do.
 
DFootCuda said:
the sad thing is that when people over pay for stuff it sets the market and we all pay.
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Exactly my point, and what I said above.
This is what I try to get accross to people that don't know.
 
Where, exactly, does one find a 'delete my post' function? Cold fingers on a keyboard make for double posts and, well, you get the idea.
The 'edit' button seems to indicate a 'delete' function, but, alas, not to be found by casual observation.
Any help appreciated so I can make this post go-away.
 
TrailBeast said:
This is exactly the case. ^
We have, and know how to use the Snap on diagnostic computer and the code said it was the OD lockup solinoid failure.
Trans is a 46RE and the solinoid is accesible with the pan off.
We found the solinoid (aftermarket unit) $60 and he asked the shop what it would cost to drop the pan and put the customer supplied solinoid in.

So basically it is a trans service and swap out the solinoid while the pan is off.
No diagnosis needed, and of course no warantee expected for the part or if the part didn't fix the problem.
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Why didn't your shop just put the solinoid in then?

If you're a shop, don't you have a trans shop that you have an existing relationship with? From shop to shop they are more likely going to go off another diagnostic.

Nonetheless, it appears the original estimate was about almost double too high. But we still don't have an itemized list of that estimate to see what was included.

That is a good gut check. I still think in transmission repair industry there are wide price differences from shop to shop. More so than in general repair.
 
autoxcuda said:
Why didn't your shop just put the solinoid in then?

If you're a shop, don't you have a trans shop that you have an existing relationship with? From shop to shop they are more likely going to go off another diagnostic.

Nonetheless, it appears the original estimate was about almost double too high. But we still don't have an itemized list of that estimate to see what was included.

That is a good gut check. I still think in transmission repair industry there are wide price differences from shop to shop. More so than in general repair.
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No I am not a shop, nor do I own one any longer.
I am retired from ASE and ATRA (Automatic Transmission Rebuilers Association) and owned an auto repair business in Cal and before that a service writer/forman/exotic trans builder for a national trans chain.
My Nephew will put it in himself with a little supervision just so he doesn't pinch a wire or something.:)
He works in a custom fab shop for Dodge trucks and is very capable, but he thought he would just have someone elso do it so he didn't have to mess with it on his day off.
For $1,100.00 he'll mess with it. :)

There was no written estimate, as he just asked if they would change it and they told him they would do it for that price.
Very likely just trying to get him to go away, since he already had his own parts.
 
TrailBeast said:
No I am not a shop, nor do I own one any longer.
I am retired from ASE and ATRA (Automatic Transmission Rebuilers Association) and owned an auto repair business in Cal and before that a service writer/forman/exotic trans builder for a national trans chain.
My Nephew will put it in himself with a little supervision just so he doesn't pinch a wire or something.:)
He works in a custom fab shop for Dodge trucks and is very capable, but he thought he would just have someone elso do it so he didn't have to mess with it on his day off.
For $1,100.00 he'll mess with it. :)

There was no written estimate, as he just asked if they would change it and they told him they would do it for that price.
Very likely just trying to get him to go away, since he already had his own parts.
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So, if this estimate was $450-550 would you still have an issue with it?

With you're backround and advice, he was not going to pay $1,100 for this repair. You determined that well before you posted on FABO. But I think it was a nice that you brought this up to everybody.

Were there any flags on the $1,100 estimate that would clue a person that's not familar with this transmission repair that would indicate $1,100 was too much?
 
It sounds more like people don't like it when someone makes a profit on them. GOD forbid they find out the shop buys a part for less than they charged the customer for. Then all of a sudden it's a RIP-OFF!! RIP-OFF!! But then when it comes to what they do it's a whole different thing. Then it's "I gotta make a living don't I?" Funny how many of us shop owners, who provide a place for others to make a living too, live for free. We don't need a paycheck to buy our food or pay rent.
But the cheap people of the world will never get it! They are never satasfied when it's done cheap because it's done 1/2 assed & they don't see a value in having it done right by experts because it cost a little more. So I do't even bother with them. I price things out fairly & honestly. If it's too much for some- oh well. So be it! I'm not the most expensive guy around but I won't be the cheapest around either. I also stand behind my work as good as or better than any others. I lose a lot of sleep at night being in business for myself, but never because I ripped someone off or because of what I charge.
I've always found the guy who is always looking for a special deal or bitches about everyone else is a guy you don't want to work for or hire to do something for you because he is the 1st guy to pull tricks to cut corners & line his pockets better.
You know, sometimes(most of the time) prices for services are driven NOT by what the market will bear as much as what's required to cover expenses & yes make a little profit. If the company you work for doesn't make a profit then you're out of a job!

Please pardon my rant!
 
TrailBeast said:
...There was no written estimate, as he just asked if they would change it and they told him they would do it for that price.
Very likely just trying to get him to go away, since he already had his own parts.
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And there you have it! :cheers: That's what the hell is going on with shops!
Sad to say it but your nephew may just have been the victim of the shops frustration with so many people before him. Unfortunate for him, I'm sure he's a good guy. But the shop owner probably thought it was another potential headache & blew him off. Not really trying to rip anybody off. It would have been better to say "We rather not install anybody's parts but our own." & then give an actual estimate.
 
I used to work part time for a electrician, he would double the estimate if he didn't want to do the job. We put in a attic fan in the middle of a heat wave after he gave the woman a really insane bid. It was a awful job. It's probably better to outprice the job then turn it down..
 
As a shop owner,I also believe they were just trying to send him on his way....
On another note how do you know the OD clutches are not gone....
Temp sensor also will keep it out of over drive....Any second gear starts could be governor pressure sensor.
Definitely needs diagnosis before just throwing parts at it....
Sorry at my shop you describe the symptoms and I diagnose the problem.
You diagnose and you fix it your way.
Talking about burned out....I am...
If I read about someone being in retail for over 20 years and they flip out on a customer,well your honor cut him some slack...LOL
 
autoxcuda said:
So, if this estimate was $450-550 would you still have an issue with it?

Were there any flags on the $1,100 estimate that would clue a person that's not familiar with this transmission repair that would indicate $1,100 was too much?
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450 - 500 I would think it was really high or a person that can do it themselves.:)
And a little high for a person that just took it in and didn't have a clue about what is involved.

The best advice I could give is to ALWAYS get at least two opinions when dealing with transmission issue's. (this could apply anywhere really)
And if they vary quite a bit, then find out why.

Of course we have FABO and if a person asks, I notice that they get pretty good information to go on.

Lonewolf,
I understand where you are coming from on your posts.
Having been in the business before, it burned me out to the point I had to quit doing it.
Seems like most everyone agrees that $1,100 was a stretch for the job at hand, and that was my main point in bringing it up here.

TXDart
I think you are right about them sending him down the road, and if YOU ever flip out on a customer I volunteer to ask the judge for leniency. :)
 
Lonewolf3165 said:
It sounds more like people don't like it when someone makes a profit on them. GOD forbid they find out the shop buys a part for less than they charged the customer for. Then all of a sudden it's a RIP-OFF!! RIP-OFF!! But then when it comes to what they do it's a whole different thing. Then it's "I gotta make a living don't I?" Funny how many of us shop owners, who provide a place for others to make a living too, live for free. We don't need a paycheck to buy our food or pay rent.
But the cheap people of the world will never get it! They are never satasfied when it's done cheap because it's done 1/2 assed & they don't see a value in having it done right by experts because it cost a little more. So I do't even bother with them. I price things out fairly & honestly. If it's too much for some- oh well. So be it! I'm not the most expensive guy around but I won't be the cheapest around either. I also stand behind my work as good as or better than any others. I lose a lot of sleep at night being in business for myself, but never because I ripped someone off or because of what I charge.
I've always found the guy who is always looking for a special deal or bitches about everyone else is a guy you don't want to work for or hire to do something for you because he is the 1st guy to pull tricks to cut corners & line his pockets better.
You know, sometimes(most of the time) prices for services are driven NOT by what the market will bear as much as what's required to cover expenses & yes make a little profit. If the company you work for doesn't make a profit then you're out of a job!

Please pardon my rant!
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X2.

When we buy parts, people think we get such a huge discount. We don't. Sometimes walk in price and our cost are uncomfortably close, and we have to mark the part up to stay in business. And if we buy cheap crappy parts to get the price down, we just put a cheap crappy part in that we have to warranty just as long as a quality part. I won't do it. If my name and reputation go into this repair, it is done right and with good quality parts. That may be OE or it may be aftermarket, depending on my experience. Also, pulling a code is like looking at a compass. It points you in the right direction. Then the skill part comes on, checking to make sure everything is capable of working electronically, that the pcm is commanding them to work, that the pcm is getting the right info,checking line pressures under different pcm commands, etc... Not as easy as looking at a scanner. The original estimate was, in my opinion, high. But your choice as a consumer is to say no and get a second opinion.

Also, when a shop is slow, I can't imagine them racking up the price to make up for slow times. Usually they lower the prices to get cars in. I don't have that problem. We are always busy and book several days in advance. I'm sure it has mostly to do with quality work at a fair price and our good reputation. And we stand behind our service. All that makes for a successful shop.
 
Hey guys;

I agree with price being high , average in midwest area would be 350 to 450 area, doing it himself will be a good learning experence for him, when he gets the pan off of that 46re and finds out that the solinoids he want to change are not visable with the pan off!!
The OD /Lu solinoids are on the top and require removal of the valvebody to replace!!!

(Labor rates just went up time wise)

Lon;
 
lkopaska said:
Hey guys;

I agree with price being high , average in midwest area would be 350 to 450 area, doing it himself will be a good learning experence for him, when he gets the pan off of that 46re and finds out that the solinoids he want to change are not visable with the pan off!!
The OD /Lu solinoids are on the top and require removal of the valvebody to replace!!!

(Labor rates just went up time wise)

Lon;
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You must be thinking of another trans.
 

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Thats right trail beast but how you going to get the screw that holds the case connector and wiring harness on the top of the valvebody???????
Cut and splice not very pro work!

Lon;
 
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