Budget Build 5.9 for a 71 Scamp

[TT5.9mag]

So I finally got all the lifters out.
View attachment 1716479736

The 8 rearmost lifters were pretty stuck. I soaked them overnight with Kroil, and was able to get them out but rotating them with a 20mm wrench on the flat portion of the lifter while I pushed up from below with a gloved finger!

Funny, the cam has rust one the rearmost 4 lobes. I hope this isn't a problem... I do plan on getting the cam reground, hopefully the regrind takes care of this issue?
View attachment 1716479737

Other thing I notice was that the cam bearings look pretty bad. I will be replacing these. Any rec's on brand is helpful as always...

View attachment 1716479738
View attachment 1716479739

Have the machine shop use durabond cam bearings. The regrind will take care of the surface rust on the cam. If it’s pitting a new core will need to be located.

 

[TT5.9mag]

The dizzy drive gear was bit hard to get out too, is it worth replacing that bushing?

It is worth replacing if it’s worn. And fairly easy.

 

[340sFastback]

For what you’re doing with the car just get stock gaskets. Forget about deck clearance, or compression ratio, or any other stuff that makes no difference to your goals. Put it together stock and it will meet your target and be dead stone axe reliable.

You are right but if it were mine I would go with .028 thick head gaskets for a slight bump in compression. Thats just me though thats how I roll....

 

[TT5.9mag]

You are right but if it were mine I would go with .028 thick head gaskets for a slight bump in compression. Thats just me though thats how I roll....

Me too. But a completely stock magnum achieves his goals. He clearly said he’s not looking for a hot rod. If it stays stock it’ll run on absolute garbage gas, make 300hp and be reliable. That’s a good cruiser/ice cream getter.

 

[CudaJason]

i'd advise against the mr. gasket units. known to leak.

felpro sells an 032 or 035 i think? which honestly, will be fine.

make sure you clean the crap out of the lifters. literally and figuratively.

100% times 2 on cleaning the lifters. I just did this with swapping a 5.9 into my 66 Barracuda. the amount of crap inside the lifters was mind blowing. my 5.9 was just as sludgey as yours is, but an hour or so of soaking in Varsol (parts Cleaner) and then taking the retainer clip out and the plunger of each lifter and cleaning them out with tiny brushes did the trick. After getting mine all back together, not a single valve train tick. plus way cheaper than a coupe hundred bucks for new lifters. just be careful not to shoot the retainer clips across the room!

 

[ScampNYC]

I emailed Oregon Cams today.
Here is what he said. Any advice? I don't speak cam-ese.

---

#1429

210/214 @ .050”, 260/264 adv, .506”/.506” lift, 111 sep

#2204

213/220 @ .050”, 265/275 adv, .480”/.498” lift, 110 sep

#1341

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .482”/.482” lift, 110 sep

#1634

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .528”/.536” lift, 110 sep

#1990

224/230 @ .050”, 276/282 adv, .510”/.510” lift, 112 sep

These are some of the most popular grinds in the area you are looking for, I can move the lobe sep around if you want something different. We can regrind your core for $239, it will take about two to three weeks.

If you send us your core please make sure to include you contact info in the box with the cam.

 

[junkyardhero]

for your application my pick would be the #2204

 

[TT5.9mag]

for your application my pick would be the #2204

Agree agree agree. I pushed the button multiple times. Nothing happens.
And if power brakes and a smooth idle are important I’d ask to have it ground on a 112.

 

[michiganpat]

I emailed Oregon Cams today.
Here is what he said. Any advice? I don't speak cam-ese.

---

#1429

210/214 @ .050”, 260/264 adv, .506”/.506” lift, 111 sep

#2204

213/220 @ .050”, 265/275 adv, .480”/.498” lift, 110 sep

#1341

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .482”/.482” lift, 110 sep

#1634

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .528”/.536” lift, 110 sep

#1990

224/230 @ .050”, 276/282 adv, .510”/.510” lift, 112 sep

These are some of the most popular grinds in the area you are looking for, I can move the lobe sep around if you want something different. We can regrind your core for $239, it will take about two to three weeks.

If you send us your core please make sure to include you contact info in the box with the cam

what are the .2" duration numbers? I assume lift is based on the magnum's 1.6 rockers? for what you want to do, I'd probably go with #1429. I bet those lobe profiles have the same, if not more duration at .2" duration than the lobes on the #2204, so it will make as much or more power and torque than the #2204, but have better idle, low end, and slightly better fuel economy with less overlap.

 

[rumblefish360]

A 5.9l with headers and 4bbl basically makes 300 hp, but if you want a mild cam don't let AJ's made up scenarios stop you from doing it, AJ don't get power is generally added throughout the powerband.

He misses a lot.

Here's a 5.9l with headers and 4bbl, stock cam VS a mild roller comp cam shown on the screen as you can the engine gains from 3,000 rpms+ and no signs of any real loss under 3,000 rpm, so if you want a cam go for it will give you gains you will notice no matter your gearing and stall.

View attachment 1716477327

Exactly. Good graph.

Here's LA low cr 360, with a bunch of mods VS stock 2bbl, headers, mild ported heads, xe250h and xe268h cams 4bbl etc.. Still makes better power everywhere over stock.

View attachment 1716477334

A winner every time.

Would you buy this? He said he'd do $850:
View attachment 1716477454

No. I myself would do the 904 OD Hyd version and cut the driveshaft down and use 3.55 gears.

Did you read my post?
Did you understand it?
Lemmee help you.
Listen; I'm trying to be nice here;


Thus OP, as a laid back streeter, on any particular day, is almost never gunna hit the PowerPeak more than once and only on the way to getting up to hiway speed....... and when he does, the Torqueflite will drag the rpm down to 59%, and it's game-over.
Therefore,
my thought is;
Why sacrifice power where you need it/want it, say from take-off to 35mph,
to get that top-end power, where you hardly ever go?
*********************
As for

Listen old man;
if reading my posts makes you sick, then why do you read them? Do you like being "vomitous"? I m ean, the solution is simple, put me on ignore.
Listen; some of the time you can't get sense of my posts anyway, and other times, you get yourself so riled up that your opinionated and never-appreciated potty-mouth comes out. I would have thought that an old-timer like you, with all your history, and being a so-called Christian on top of that, could do better.
Listen brother; I forgive you for so-often berating me. I turn the other cheek, cuz I don't want you to burn in hell on my account.
Listen, tough guy; I can't do anything about your belly-sickness, that's on you to get rid of; do I need to remind you what works for me?

You wouldn’t get so much slack if you actually knew what you’re talking about and should actually do some more hot rodding and experimenting rather than relying on calculators and assumptions and here say.

You make consistent assumptions about people and the way they drive is like how you drive consistently “Blowing the tires off” and etc… if your repetitive ramblings of bullshit that doesn’t apply.

I consistently call you out on it and now I’m glad everyone else is calling you out because I was becoming weary of pointing out how outright wrong you were and explaining the whys of the corrections.

I don’t do it to be mean, just correcting misinformation from being spread.

You can call me mean and what ever else you want but it’s actually not true since I sit here feeling like a teacher correcting students with just a sigh. Asking myself why.
How can this be?
Claimed 55 years of doing stuff and knows nothing.
Caught in consistent lies of mega mileage only to later bulge pertinent information not included in the original answer while you subtly insult and make fun of people.

Now if you wanna call me mean and say I’m off my meds, go for it but at least I’m telling the truth and trying to help people, with honesty and facts with experience.

I’ll also tell you *I Think* & I’m not sure or don’t know.

You do note every time almost when you feel I’m being mean but never note when I agree or support your answers as good.

Why people keep correcting you, as you can plainly see in the 2 dyno graphs provided plus the 1,000's of others out there, a mild cam made power practically throughout the whole powerband not just above 5,0000 rpms which the OP might find useful the extra under 5,000 rpms power and the odd time above 5,000 rpms if he chooses to go that way. Everyone is allowed an opinion but spreading faulty facts isn't opinion it's being manipulative.

BINGO

I emailed Oregon Cams today.
Here is what he said. Any advice? I don't speak cam-ese.

---

#1429

210/214 @ .050”, 260/264 adv, .506”/.506” lift, 111 sep

#2204

213/220 @ .050”, 265/275 adv, .480”/.498” lift, 110 sep

#1341

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .482”/.482” lift, 110 sep

#1634

218/224 @ .050”, 270/276 adv, .528”/.536” lift, 110 sep

#1990

224/230 @ .050”, 276/282 adv, .510”/.510” lift, 112 sep

These are some of the most popular grinds in the area you are looking for, I can move the lobe sep around if you want something different. We can regrind your core for $239, it will take about two to three weeks.

If you send us your core please make sure to include you contact info in the box with the cam.

The 218@050 is as large as I would go.
I myself would go as low as the 213@050.
I have a 226@050 in the wife’s car and it will be a big benefit to increase the stall 2500 rpm plus, the stock converter is not that high and will tolerate a 218 at MAX.

The 218 will make very good power to 5500 no problem.

If these lifts are based off of a 1.5 rocker, you need to do the math on the new lift and equip the valve springs as necessary.

Listed lift divided by 1.5 then multiply by 1.6 for the new lift value.

Use a solid lifter (purchase 2, intake and exhaust) and clay to check the clearance of the valve to piston.

 

[ScampNYC]

Thanks for all the input on the cam selection... please keep your votes coming. I don't mind a slight lope, I like it even, but want great off idle performance and drivability.

Hey this is a bit off topic from the cam, but I am putting together a Summit cart and thinking about the fuel pump. What do folks think of the Holley Mighty Mite? The price works in my budget nicely, and I like the small size, plus folks say its fairly quiet ... Holley 12-427 Holley Mighty Mite Electric Fuel Pumps | Summit Racing
Would I need a regulator too?

 

[ScampNYC]

Another cam regrinding outfit got back to me, Bullet Cams.
Here's what this guy said:

---

Hello Sam,
there are 2 different size of stock cams these engines come with from the factory.
They are both small cams. We can not make a big change to the grind as the stock
Heat treat is not deep.
This is about all that will fit the stock core.

Thank you,
Chris

Intake Exhaust
Duration at .050 200 203
Lobe Lift 0.2900 0.2900
Separation 111 OP CL OP CL
Timing Events @.050 -7.0 27.0 36.5 %-13.5
Duration @.006 257 260
Gross Valve lift 0.4640 0.4640
Rocker Ratio 1.6 1.6
Valve Lash 0.000 0.000
Degree Intake Lobe to 107

 

[michiganpat]

Another cam regrinding outfit got back to me, Bullet Cams.
Here's what this guy said:

---

Hello Sam,
there are 2 different size of stock cams these engines come with from the factory.
They are both small cams. We can not make a big change to the grind as the stock
Heat treat is not deep.
This is about all that will fit the stock core.

Thank you,
Chris

Intake Exhaust
Duration at .050 200 203
Lobe Lift 0.2900 0.2900
Separation 111 OP CL OP CL
Timing Events @.050 -7.0 27.0 36.5 %-13.5
Duration @.006 257 260
Gross Valve lift 0.4640 0.4640
Rocker Ratio 1.6 1.6
Valve Lash 0.000 0.000
Degree Intake Lobe to 107

granted when I did it back in 2006 or so, I sent them a roller cam core from my '85 5th avenue 318 (was a carbed motor so it had the long snout for a mechanical fuel pump). on that core they were able to do this lobe for the intake: HR259/316 which is 259@0.006 (adv) 208@0.05 127@0.2 0.3160 lobe lift (.506@valve) and this lobe on the exhaust: HR265/320 265@0.006 (adv) 212@0.050 131@0.2 0.3200 lobe lift (.512@valve) on the factory cam's 110 LSA. IIRC they told me the LA roller cams were heat treated deeper than the magnums, but again, that was 20 years ago. of the options you have shown, I'd still say the #1429 from Oregon Cams Bullet Cams Master List

 

[rumblefish360]

Another cam regrinding outfit got back to me, Bullet Cams.
Here's what this guy said:

---

Hello Sam,
there are 2 different size of stock cams these engines come with from the factory.
They are both small cams. We can not make a big change to the grind as the stock
Heat treat is not deep.
This is about all that will fit the stock core.

Thank you,
Chris

Intake Exhaust
Duration at .050 200 203
Lobe Lift 0.2900 0.2900
Separation 111 OP CL OP CL
Timing Events @.050 -7.0 27.0 36.5 %-13.5
Duration @.006 257 260
Gross Valve lift 0.4640 0.4640
Rocker Ratio 1.6 1.6
Valve Lash 0.000 0.000
Degree Intake Lobe to 107

I think it small. Lobes a little slow.

 

[remytherat]

I have the 2204. Reasonably smooth idle with around 14 inches of vacuum iirc. Solid torque. Would recommend.

 

[remytherat]

these engines come with from the factory.
They are both small cams. We can not make a big change to the grind as the stock
Heat treat is not deep.
This is about all that will fit the stock core.

Bullshit.

 

[nckennyb]

I used a Carter P90091 fuel pump on my Duster and mounted it right above the tank sending unit and routed the fuel hose kind of looped around to hook to the factory hard line. It works fine with no regulator. It's made for use with a carburetor and its quiet or at least I can't hear it with my bad ears.

 

[junkyardhero]

Agree agree agree. I pushed the button multiple times. Nothing happens.
And if power brakes and a smooth idle are important I’d ask to have it ground on a 112.

pssh... 112?

naw man, it's gotta be 108. because: i'M aBoUt tHaT cHoP!!!1!
[sounding cool > going fast]

 

[TT5.9mag]

Bullshit.

How do they test the depth of the heat treat? Do you know?

 

[Mopar Sam]

Another cam regrinding outfit got back to me, Bullet Cams.
Here's what this guy said:

---

Hello Sam,
there are 2 different size of stock cams these engines come with from the factory.
They are both small cams. We can not make a big change to the grind as the stock
Heat treat is not deep.
This is about all that will fit the stock core.

Thank you,
Chris

Intake Exhaust
Duration at .050 200 203
Lobe Lift 0.2900 0.2900
Separation 111 OP CL OP CL
Timing Events @.050 -7.0 27.0 36.5 %-13.5
Duration @.006 257 260
Gross Valve lift 0.4640 0.4640
Rocker Ratio 1.6 1.6
Valve Lash 0.000 0.000
Degree Intake Lobe to 107

My son has been running a Delta regrind for a bunch of years. It is 232/232 @.050 .575/.575 . His only vehicle.

Never any problems. Daily dependable.

 

[rumblefish360]

Bullshit.

I agree but then again, someone maybe scared for a reason they don’t go further.

How do they test the depth of the heat treat? Do you know?

I can’t remember the figure but generally speaking a heat treated part is not deep at all. Not even .010. It’s more of a surface treatment on most parts.

Of course, there are other methods for different parts to heat treated part deeper stronger and more durable.

 

[TT5.9mag]

I agree but then again, someone maybe scared for a reason they don’t go further.

I can’t remember the figure but generally speaking a heat treated part is not deep at all. Not even .010. It’s more of a surface treatment on most parts.

Of course, there are other methods for different parts to heat treated part deeper stronger and more durable.

Understand. But how do they test the depth of the heat treat?

 

[rumblefish360]

Understand. But how do they test the depth of the heat treat?

I don’t remember. I read about it a while back which was an interesting read that I am so sorry, can not repeat because I didn’t retain it.

But I do remember the depths were like a sneeze of nothing deep. It actually seemed laughable. But it works.

Considering you can have a cam cut really heavy and have it heat treated again and perform great, I see no big deal in regrinding cams and cranks and then re heat treated again them.

 

[remytherat]

How do they test the depth of the heat treat? Do you know?

I think it’s probably mostly gone, at least off the base circle. That said, I think the concern is laughable with
1. roller lifters
2. low spring pressure
3. low rpm
4. not very aggressive profile
5. casual use application

The reality is that you never hear about regrind roller failures that have anything to do with the cam itself.

In fairness to the company, they totally have a right to not want to take on that risk.

 

[CudaJason]

I used a Carter P90091 fuel pump on my Duster and mounted it right above the tank sending unit and routed the fuel hose kind of looped around to hook to the factory hard line. It works fine with no regulator. It's made for use with a carburetor and its quiet or at least I can't hear it with my bad ears.

That’s a great pump. I have used Carter electric pumps for years and that 90091 I have in my 39 ford with a early Vette 283, I have almost 45,000 miles on it and it’s been on there almost 6 years, no issues, and yeah it’s whisper quiet.

If you’re gonna use an electric pumps, wire in a switch that you hide somewhere that switches the ground for the fuel pump relay. That way if you are gonna work on it and need to turn the key on, you can switch the pump off. Plus it’s a little extra security. If someone tries to steal it, they are only getting as far as what fuel is in the carb.