273 Electronic Ignition Issues

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OK now it is bad for sure!:rofl: I love breaking stuff also. They say made in usa on them no makers mark but came from a closed parts store in Canada noting on them except the sticker and the transistor. Every one tested good and that is unusual.

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67Dart273 said:
These are not that bad. If you want to phone, I can step you through a few checks.
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I may take you up on that, but I want to get working parts before I start stringing them together. There's a solid chance based on the advice here and my independent reading/researching that I have **** strung together that doesn't belong there. Ex: if I have electronic ignition and not points, why do I have a ballast resistor in the mix? I just received a new cap, plug wires, and coil - but turns out I got a coil with oil and not silicone (it sits sideways). I know the traditional route is to find the "thing" that failed. But I can't trust the work the mechanic did on this so something else is likely to fail soon too. So I'm replacing the whole damn thing with the right quality parts that belong there.
 
Not me and they do look the same. I wish I got them for that. Thanks.
 
I did steal the picture from a fast search since I did not have one from the shop. I do do paypal and send invoices. I have no idea how vemo works.
 
Here’s a little wire map I made. Plus some additional photos. I’m considering what to do with the four wires at the ballast resistor to bypass them.

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This is the MP diagram. I believe your brown wire is the yello on the diagram, just verify it. Make sure the wires are routed the same and your colors on the ecu harnes can be different. The yellow in yours should be brown. No idea who made it.
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halifaxhops said:
This is the MP diagram. I believe your brown wire is the yello on the diagram, just verify it. Make sure the wires are routed the same and your colors on the ecu harnes can be different. No idea who made it.
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THAT DIAGRAM is NOT CORRECT You are right the yellow should be brown but more important it does NOT go to the start relay
 
67Dart273 said:
THAT DIAGRAM is NOT CORRECT You are right the yellow should be brown but more important it does NOT go to the start relay
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I thought he could read into it it or whats written under it. It is the start circuit from the ign switch pretty obvious. My Bad!
 
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halifaxhops said:
I thought he could read into it it or whats written under it. It is the start circuit from the ign switch pretty obvious. My Bad!
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When I have an hour of down time over the next few days, I'll be mapping out my exact wiring diagram, color coding it, and posting for all to critique. All the wires have been wrapped together so I'll be removing that wrapping to see what the heck is going on and where each one goes. I'll do the map digitally so we can make sense of it.

I won't be bypassing anything. Just bought two ECUs from Halifaxshops. I have a new cap and new wires, but I don't like the ends of them - they stick straight out rather than angle in for a cleaner look. Before I buy anything else, I'll be ask you all. If you have parts you want to sell me, I'm all ears too. I'd rather help out you guys rather than the online stores.
 
Is it possible that the distributor clamp was loose and allowed the dist' to turn? Its not even close to where it should be. Vacuum port on spark advance should be pointed to the right. This isn't so critical if you know where the rotor is and where plug wires belong. Maybe the installer put the distributor in this way but... Dropping the distributor in just any wrong position doesn't help the novice. Factory diagrams, #1 marked on the cap, etc,, will not apply. Good luck with it.
 
RedFish said:
Is it possible that the distributor clamp was loose and allowed the dist' to turn? Its not even close to where it should be. Vacuum port on spark advance should be pointed to the right. This isn't so critical if you know where the rotor is and where plug wires belong. Maybe the installer put the distributor in this way but... Dropping the distributor in just any wrong position doesn't help the novice. Factory diagrams, #1 marked on the cap, etc,, will not apply. Good luck with it.
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I just tried to turn the distributor by hand and it doesn't move.
 
ECU required an electronic voltage regulator for tighter operating voltages. That points style is not up to their spec for an ECU. Just an observation. Distributor not turning is a problem if its out of the car, check reluctor clearance again, could be jammed up there.
 
halifaxhops said:
I thought he could read into it it or whats written under it. It is the start circuit from the ign switch pretty obvious. My Bad!
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I think this came from swapping those into some of the newer rigs (maybe lean burn??) that had the later model oddball starter relay. They had an additional contact I call them a "Jeep" relay

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You should not have to trace those wires. That is why in a post above I gave you voltage measurements to take, here is the deal

The ignition switch has of course

BATTERY power into it off the ammeter circuit. This is NOT fused

The outputs are as follows

ACCESSORY.......This feeds power to the switched buss in the accessory fuse panel, and is hot with the key in either "run" or "acc." This feeds stuff like wipers, heater, radio, etc

RUN or IGN1....This is hot ONLY in the "run" position, ONLY. This is normally dark blue and feeds out through the bulkhead connector, and feeds such things under the hood as the VR IGN terminal, the "key" side of the ballast resistor, on some cars electric choke if used. This is NOT fused.

"BYPASS" or IGN2.....This comes off a separate ignition switch contact and is hot ONLY in "start" just like the "start" wire below........but it is a SEPARATE circuit. This feeds out into the bay and goes to the coil+ side of the ballast. THIS IS WHAT provides starting power during cranking This wire is normally brown out of the bulkhead

"START" Like "bypass" above, this is hot with the key in start. Normally yellow, this feeds out through the bulkhead to the starter relay. On auto trans cars, the "cold" side of the relay coil / magnet leads down to the transmission neutral safety switch, which goes to ground in P or N so the start relay will fire from the key

So you NEED to determine if both the RUN / IGN1 and the BYPASS/ IGN2 are working, because both are needed to start and run

So again..........Clip your meter from coil+ to ground, and turn the key to "run". Read the meter. Current is flowing through the system, through the resistor, through the coil, and through the ignition box and SHOULD BE lower than 12V (lower than battery v) You could expect maybe 6-10V here. If lower, it's not getting "something" and if up near battery, the box/ coil/ resistor is not drawing current

Next, with meter connected as above, crank engine while watcing meter. Do this using the key. You want to see minimum of 10.5 or more, and hopefully very close to same as battery......EG if battery is 11, this voltage should read close to 11

These two readings tell you that the system is getting power from the harness, and you don't need to chase wiring around under the dash "for now."
 
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67Dart273 said:
You should not have to trace those wires. That is why in a post above I gave you voltage measurements to take, here is the deal

The ignition switch has of course

BATTERY power into it off the ammeter circuit. This is NOT fused

The outputs are as follows

ACCESSORY.......This feeds power to the switched buss in the accessory fuse panel, and is hot with the key in either "run" or "acc." This feeds stuff like wipers, heater, radio, etc

RUN or IGN1....This is hot ONLY in the "run" position, ONLY. This is normally dark blue
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Perfect. So I won't trace. As soon as I get the new ECU in the mail from Halifaxgod, I'll hook it back up and test the voltage measurements as instructed.
 
OK. When you install the new module, make sure it is grounded to the case.

I said that the diagram Halifaxshops posted was incorrect. Only the yellow is incorrect. Regardless of color (usually brown) this wire gets power in "start" from the brown/ bypass/ IGN2 terminal of the key. So if you note that it is in fact correct

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67Dart273 said:
OK. When you install the new module, make sure it is grounded to the case.

I said that the diagram Halifaxshops posted was incorrect. Only the yellow is incorrect. Regardless of color (usually brown) this wire gets power in "start" from the brown/ bypass/ IGN2 terminal of the key. So if you note that it is in fact correct

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Looking at that diagram and comparing it to mine, then it's wired correctly. So now I just need to put the components back together and try firing it up. Yes, I'll need to clear the area of any paint, use the correct washers as previously recommended, same with the larger screws to make sure it's grounded properly.
 
UPDATE: I know it's been a long, long time. Anyways, I'm back at it and after purchasing an OEM ECU (ICU), and hooking it back up, the old Dart fires right up without issue. I believe the aftermarket junk ICU was a problem, but not THE problem that caused it to shut off when I hit the pothole. I think a wire came loose on the ballast resistor. When I was tracing the wires earlier on, I notice the bottom wire on the resistor had fallen off. So I tightened that connection and installed the new ICU from halifaxhops. Zero issue now. Thank you all for your replies and assistance! Happy the old girl is running again.
 
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