/6 198 rods needed badly

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/6 Matt said:
I think if it really mattered, it wouldn't be called an opinion, Bill.
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Well, the veracity of an an "opinion" comes from the background of the opinion-holder's experience in the subject-matter... If you have a heart problem, do you ask a teenage kid or a cardiologist?

David Reher has, for many years, made his living, building and dyno-testing racing engines, and has that experience from which to form his opinions.
His opinion is based on years and years of solid experience... That's important to me.

I think he's in a better position to have access to more accurate information on the subject than a person who ( like me,) just does this as a hobby... that's all.

Is that faulty reasoning?
 
Nice thread guys! Threads like this help us younger guys learn!

Nice to see the combo you posted /6 Matt! I have a complete super six motor out of a 79 aspen that I wanna turbo sometime just for the fun of it. I'd read somewhere b4 that the cast cranks were strong enough for most builds and was just thinkin bout that today or yesterday, good to see it be true!
 
Bill Dedman said:
Well, the veracity of an an "opinion" comes from the background of the opinion-holder's experience in the subject-matter... If you have a heart problem, do you ask a teenage kid or a cardiologist?

David Reher has, for many years, made his living, building and dyno-testing racing engines, and has that experience from which to form his opinions.
His opinion is based on years and years of solid experience... That's important to me.

I think he's in a better position to have access to more accurate information on the subject than a person who ( like me,) just does this as a hobby... that's all.

Is that faulty reasoning?
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I kind of see it as faulty reasoning because you seem to be ignoring the difference between fact and opinion. Here are there definitions as per Merriam Webster:

Opinion: noun- A belief or judgement or way of thinking about something, what someone thinks about a particular thing.

Fact: noun-Something that truly exists or happens, something that has actual existence.

My point is, my opinion doesn't matter. Your opinion doesn't matter. David Reher's opinion doesn't matter. Doug Dutra's opinion doesn't matter (he also agrees long rods build power). Nobodies opinion matter and nobody will ever know for sure until somone builds two identical slants with the only changing X-factors being the rod length, compression height and deck height (to keep compression the same) and then they put them on the same dyno on the same day with the same operator and find out if the numbers differ or not.
 
75slant6 said:
Nice thread guys! Threads like this help us younger guys learn!

Nice to see the combo you posted /6 Matt! I have a complete super six motor out of a 79 aspen that I wanna turbo sometime just for the fun of it. I'd read somewhere b4 that the cast cranks were strong enough for most builds and was just thinkin bout that today or yesterday, good to see it be true!
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Good to hear buddy!
 
RustyRatRod said:
What I find hilarious is that about a year ago, I was having this same argument, but I was on the other side. I was arguing that a long rod was better for the street. I was wrong. Now that I've done quite a bit of reading on the subject and know piston speed is good for the street, I come on here arguing that point and I am argued with again. I it's funny as hell no matter which way I argue, it is always assumed I am wrong. You caint have it both ways.
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What fun would FABO be if we weren't all always arguing in the stupid corner?:toothy7:
 
[/QUOTE] My point is, my opinion doesn't matter. Your opinion doesn't matter. David Reher's opinion doesn't matter. Doug Dutra's opinion doesn't matter (he also agrees long rods build power). Nobodies opinion matter and nobody will ever know for sure until somone builds two identical slants with the only changing X-factors being the rod length, compression height and deck height (to keep compression the same) and then they put them on the same dyno on the same day with the same operator and find out if the numbers differ or not.[/QUOTE]





Well, that's a valid opinion as far as it goes, but this is discussion is about the factor in assessing the validity of varied opinions:

RE: How much in the way of "qualification" does the holder of opinion A have, compared with the holder of opinion B?

The way you describe opinions would make one think that all opinions have equal validity.

Not so.

Otherwise, you're throwing your money away when you go see a $500.00 an-hour lawyer for his opinion about whether you should sue someone who has (you feel) has "wronged" you.... you might as well ask anybody on the street... I'm sure if you clued them in, they would have an opinion... everybody's got one.

My cardiologist is currently giving me his opinion of my current heart condition... and, I listen to him, do what he says to do, and pay him LARGE amounts of money because he has experience with hearts that act-up like mine does... and I'd like to live at least a little longer, so the opinion of a person not versed in the vagaries of cardiology wouldn't, probably, have all the correct information to get it right... and, I NEED to have somebody "get it right."

I think David Reher's countless hours on the dyno and many years of experience in engine design (and, yes, he experimented a lot with rod-length/stroke ratios,) puts his opinion a quantum-leap ahead of mine, and probably yours, too, when it comes to having a better-than-average chance of being right.

Makes sense... If he didn't learn what works, (and, not?) of what value is all that time?
 
Lol! I guess I have a rare engine. When I bought my car I thought it was a 225. I checked behind the alternator and found out I actually have a 198. I dont get chrysler...they put shorter rods on a long throw crank (225) and long rods on a short throw crank (198 ). Everything else is indentical. They should have came up with something way better, like a factory turbo six or a better flowing head 225. Idk.
 
MoparChic71 said:
Lol! I guess I have a rare engine. When I bought my car I thought it was a 225. I checked behind the alternator and found out I actually have a 198. I dont get chrysler...they put shorter rods on a long throw crank (225) and long rods on a short throw crank (198 ). Everything else is indentical. They should have came up with something way better, like a factory turbo six or a better flowing head 225. Idk.
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X-2!!!! :angry7:
 
MoparChic71 said:
Lol! I guess I have a rare engine. When I bought my car I thought it was a 225. I checked behind the alternator and found out I actually have a 198. I dont get chrysler...they put shorter rods on a long throw crank (225) and long rods on a short throw crank (198 ). Everything else is indentical. They should have came up with something way better, like a factory turbo six or a better flowing head 225. Idk.
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It was necessary to change the rod length when changing the stroke, to keep the correct deck hight.

Chrysler did do testing of a turbo slant six, for use in a truck application, back in the '70's. I spoke to Larry Sheppard about it, when I was building my turbo motor. He told me they dropped the project because they couldn't get the engine to live. He did not tell me what the problem was.
 
Your right Charrlie, I read that Tom Hoover was behind that project and drove that truck from Detroit to California as a test mule.The other factor was cost, and at the time it was thought the buying public wouldn't go for it. Anyway I think alot of people had 198's thinking they were 225's and never knowing.
 
so what happened to the OP? did he finally realize that the molnar rods are cheaper than the stock ones?
 
Choosing a rod in terms of what it will give you is much harder than choosing it because it is the right length to connect the piston to the crank. The fact is, if you spend the time designing and working on the other more important variables to building power, the rod length really won't mean much of anything. Smokey Yunick shared RM's opinion because he, like them, worried far more about the other details. Even in a slant - the rod length in and of itself won't mean much. You'd do much better to use whatever rods you have and spend on a quality set of custom pistons than worry about the rod length or ratio.
 
moper said:
Choosing a rod in terms of what it will give you is much harder than choosing it because it is the right length to connect the piston to the crank. The fact is, if you spend the time designing and working on the other more important variables to building power, the rod length really won't mean much of anything. Smokey Yunick shared RM's opinion because he, like them, worried far more about the other details. Even in a slant - the rod length in and of itself won't mean much. You'd do much better to use whatever rods you have and spend on a quality set of custom pistons than worry about the rod length or ratio.
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Wiseco/K-1 makes it easy for you. We bought their "package" deal a few years ago (I think they're cheaper, now) and got H-beam rods, of the 198-length (approximately 7"-long, forged pistons with a low-drag, "thin" ring package and ARP rod bolts that yielded 9:1 compression with no milling of the head or block.

All we had to do was set the end-gap on the rings and bolt it together. :)

We're terribly lazy, so that fit us just fine...:blob:
 
I don't call that lazy. There's a lot more return from spending on a quality piston regardless of ease of aquisition. Still - I don't think that will work for me. The plan is a longer stroke and the factory 225 rod. Plus the heads will be heavilly modified including reducing and shaping the chambers. I'll need something a bit more unique in terms of the dome design and I also want the thinnest rings I can get with the medium tension oil ring package. I do not plan on boost for a while, if ever.
 
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