air gap install, guide pins on deck!!!

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kfrese

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Im glad you guys are around, well my intake doesn't lay in the valley because there are two I guess guide pins maybe for a stock intake. Wierd, I don't remember these on my last dart years ago when I put new intake. So being that this is an area that needs to stay nice and flat, what do I do to get these puppies gone? Cut, can they be pulled? This bites. Thanks guys

:wack::wack::wack::wack::wack::wack::wack::wack:
 
Yep, I pulled mine out with a pair of needle nose, think they are only about 1/4" long if memory serves. Don't even think I used the gasket for the valleys either, just put some black rubber gasket from Autozone on there, hardened up fine, no leaks.
 
They can be pulled right out. Make sure you protect from them falling into the block if they slip out of your grip
 
Diag' pliers will pull them out too. If you clean the pin holes good and put a large bead of RTV across there filling the hole, it will serve as an anchor of sorts for the RTV.
I used a red hi temp RTV , picked up at Oreilles. Matched the red engine paint fairly well.
 
When you set the intake up, be sure to mark the center of the runners or separator wall on the head and do the same on the intake to center it.

I use a front and rear gasket, but I use the foam gasket, with black RTV along the entire back side and at the corners. I've found that this sets up much quicker and lasts longer than just using RTV. Do NOT use cork, unless you want a busted intake at the distributor opening. The aluminum can't crush cork.
 
ok I had everthing set, was just going to do the black rtv on the edges, now it looks like a pretty big space. The head gaskets have little tabs sticking out which Im sure are preventing the intake from seating down more, should I cut those flush with the heads to take that out of the mix, and the damn bolts I bought were too short, does anyone know what size intake bolts I need for this airgap edelbrock laying on a 340 deck, bolting into 318 heads. AHHHHH!! BREATH, RELAX,CLEAN UP THE RTV AND START OVER!!! HEY THOSE SIDE GASKETS MAY BRIDGE THE GAP BETTER THAN JUST RTV OR WHAT??

:banghead::banghead:
 
I leave those tabs to also serve as fingers to anchor the RTV just like they helped hold the OEM cork. My experience is not with aftermarket parts though. You may need to cut them off. I cant imagine them being thick enough to interfere where there is 1/4" gap between the OEM parts.
 
I don't know what size bolts a 340 uses but I do know Edelbrock recommends RTV only on the front and rear gasket faces. I don't believe the head gasket tabs should overhang at all and should end flush with the block if memory serves. You can download the install instructions from the Edelbrock site and it will also give you more info on torquing and such.
Good luck.
 
The two tabs on each side are to help with cork gaskets from shifting forward or backwards as you install.

I've always found them to be culprit for leaking at the corners, but I'm also not a fan of using only RTV. When I pulled the last iron intake, it had about a year worth of use on it.

When I pulled it, I noticed an odd pattern that the silicone had running through it, almost like woodgrain at the mating surface where the intake sat. I'm not sure what caused it, but I'm wondering now, if the silicone didn't cure quick enough for use. It sat a a day before it was used.

I put a really even bead on the front and rear deck after installing the gaskets and got leaking here and there.

I think the reason Edelbrock suggests silicone is because of the crush issue with a common cork gasket. I've seen people break intake manifolds, trying to get those to crush on install, so I understand that. Mopar Performance supplies a soft foam gasket for the front and rear that I use, along with RTV to lock the oil out of the gasket on the inside and in the corners.

I trimmed the head gasket tabs with a triangle file, moving out, away from the oil galley with a shop towel behind it in the galley, took the towel out and vacuumed the area, just to be safe.

When you put the intake on, just go slow and try to straight down to keep from shifting it much.

One thing you may try with only silicone, is to set the intake on to the bead, with a thin coat on the front and rear of the intake to maybe help prevent the condition I was seeing, so the RTV bonds to itself, then start the bolts, but don't tighten them for at least a day. That way, the silicone will have elasticity and squish a few thousandths and help promote seal.

Also, do yourself a favor and run a little RTV on the threads as well as under the head/ washer of the bolt, so you don't get oil wicking up the bolt threads from the oil galley. All the LA intake bolts are the same. They are a 3/8" -16 pitch thread x 2". The threads don't start until about 1/4" into the head. The intake plenum gaskets should have an index that goes into 4 of the holes (2 on each side) to keep the gaskets centered.
 
DaveBonds said:
The two tabs on each side are to help with cork gaskets from shifting forward or backwards as you install.

I've always found them to be culprit for leaking at the corners, but I'm also not a fan of using only RTV. When I pulled the last iron intake, it had about a year worth of use on it.

When I pulled it, I noticed an odd pattern that the silicone had running through it, almost like woodgrain at the mating surface where the intake sat. I'm not sure what caused it, but I'm wondering now, if the silicone didn't cure quick enough for use. It sat a a day before it was used.

I put a really even bead on the front and rear deck after installing the gaskets and got leaking here and there.

I think the reason Edelbrock suggests silicone is because of the crush issue with a common cork gasket. I've seen people break intake manifolds, trying to get those to crush on install, so I understand that. Mopar Performance supplies a soft foam gasket for the front and rear that I use, along with RTV to lock the oil out of the gasket on the inside and in the corners.

I trimmed the head gasket tabs with a triangle file, moving out, away from the oil galley with a shop towel behind it in the galley, took the towel out and vacuumed the area, just to be safe.

When you put the intake on, just go slow and try to straight down to keep from shifting it much.

One thing you may try with only silicone, is to set the intake on to the bead, with a thin coat on the front and rear of the intake to maybe help prevent the condition I was seeing, so the RTV bonds to itself, then start the bolts, but don't tighten them for at least a day. That way, the silicone will have elasticity and squish a few thousandths and help promote seal.

Also, do yourself a favor and run a little RTV on the threads as well as under the head/ washer of the bolt, so you don't get oil wicking up the bolt threads from the oil galley. All the LA intake bolts are the same. They are a 3/8" -16 pitch thread x 2". The threads don't start until about 1/4" into the head. The intake plenum gaskets should have an index that goes into 4 of the holes (2 on each side) to keep the gaskets centered.
Click to expand...

The graining you saw was probably because the person that did it used multiple beads (back and forth over it) and it set up a little in between.
I used the all metal factory intake gaskets with a thin film of red rtv around all the ports and water jackets, and then one solid bead on the front and rear about 3/8 thick and I don't have even so much as a damp spot anywhere, (And you don't see any rtv anywhere) it looks like there isn't a seal between the block and the intake.
I got the intake gaskets in place on the heads and then dropped the intake on as fast as I could after the rtv went on the front and rear.
Then I tightened in a cross pattern about a half turn at a time on the bolts until it was down tight.

They (whoever they are) say you are not supposed to use the metal intake gaskets with aluminum intakes, but it worked just fine.
No oil leaks, no vacuum leaks, no coolant leaks, but I have a ton of experience using rtv and know how it acts in different circumstances.

That was a dang good call on the intake bolt heads and threads Dave, because if you don't do that you WILL have puddles around the bolts.
I also cut the locating tab off the head gaskets where the heads, block and intake all meet to keep it from possibly interfering with the seal.
 
Little trick for RTV.

Place intake down on engine and use a magic marker to line the ends of the intake on the valley ends of your block. You have the outer edge marked. Saves on wiping stuff down and wasting RTV.

One area on a SB that can be troublesome is the pass side front of valley. Pay attention to the bottom of your intake and the block mating surfaces so you get good coverage.
 
crackedback said:
Little trick for RTV.

Place intake down on engine and use a magic marker to line the ends of the intake on the valley ends of your block. You have the outer edge marked. Saves on wiping stuff down and wasting RTV.

One area on a SB that can be troublesome is the pass side front of valley. Pay attention to the bottom of your intake and the block mating surfaces so you get good coverage.
Click to expand...

That's true.
There is a slight almost mismatch between the block and the intake there.
 
Those side gaskets may or may not work depending on the heads, gaskets and the milling. If I use the supplied cork end gaskets I can't get the bolts to line up. I have to use RTV, and a very large bead. We have tried many kinds over the years, and the best one we found was from GM. It's a grey silicone that you can use in a caulk style gun. It never leaks.
 
TrailBeast said:
The graining you saw was probably because the person that did it used multiple beads (back and forth over it) and it set up a little in between.
I used the all metal factory intake gaskets with a thin film of red rtv around all the ports and water jackets, and then one solid bead on the front and rear about 3/8 thick and I don't have even so much as a damp spot anywhere, (And you don't see any rtv anywhere) it looks like there isn't a seal between the block and the intake.
I got the intake gaskets in place on the heads and then dropped the intake on as fast as I could after the rtv went on the front and rear.
Then I tightened in a cross pattern about a half turn at a time on the bolts until it was down tight.

They (whoever they are) say you are not supposed to use the metal intake gaskets with aluminum intakes, but it worked just fine.
No oil leaks, no vacuum leaks, no coolant leaks, but I have a ton of experience using rtv and know how it acts in different circumstances.

That was a dang good call on the intake bolt heads and threads Dave, because if you don't do that you WILL have puddles around the bolts.
I also cut the locating tab off the head gaskets where the heads, block and intake all meet to keep it from possibly interfering with the seal.
Click to expand...

Using metal intake gasket on my 318 stock with a aluminum intake, I sprayed the gasket with permatex copper, RTV the ends, with no silicone on the bolts. Some puddles of oil around the bolt holes.

The motor now has a constant blue smoke out the exhaust at idle, where it did not with the 2-barrel intake.

I would say this is caused by the intake sucking some oil in the combusiton chamber, but the truck runs really good for what it is.

Sorry for the hyjack
 
Well cool deal guys got her bolted on, she will have plenty of time to cure, sitting on a engine stand. Thanks again for all the expert knowledge. :)
 
Those pin holes are not drilled for a reason. Your new intake does not have them because you need to align the ports before they are drilled.

There is a procedure for this. It makes the difference from having an intake for looks or having it for performance.


They should be used to hold your intake where it is suppose to stay to keep the ports aligned. If you notice you can move the intake front and back with the bolts in loose. \


The web on the intake runners is not that wide. It is important to keep them centered during install. Finding center is an easy task.


Every motor we build the intakes runners are matched. SB mopars are great for having the pins. Using them is a no brainer for those who are not lazy.

Little motors are the underdogs so we need to squeeze every pony and RPM out of them we can.
 

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crackedback said:
One area on a SB that can be troublesome is the pass side front of valley. Pay attention to the bottom of your intake and the block mating surfaces so you get good coverage.
Click to expand...

What he said. If your silicone bead does not sweep back on that front passenger's side its gonna leak.
 
Do not ever use silllycone. Once used, you can never clean the surface, and the crap is no good. Right stuff from permatex works.
 
green1 said:
Do not ever use silllycone. Once used, you can never clean the surface, and the crap is no good. Right stuff from permatex works.
Click to expand...

X2 never had any leaks with the Right Stuff. I've used this on several intakes and never a problem.

Fred B
 
green1 said:
Do not ever use silllycone. Once used, you can never clean the surface, and the crap is no good. Right stuff from permatex works.
Click to expand...

Just because "the right stuff" is good does not mean everything else is crap.
You must not have a lot of real world experience to make a statement like this.
 
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