Asking a couple questions-will my A body corner?

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justthatguy

justthatguy

Josh(69 Valiant)
Joined
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Danville, VA
Hey all, first post here in a while, but, I have reached the point to where I am sick of the useless 145 hp of the slant 6 and its almost a certainty that I will move up to a 360. I had considered selling the valiant and buying any number of other cars, most notably, a Mitsubishi Eclipse GT, a C4 Corvette, and a Jaguar XJS. None of these prove a viable route for me (Corvette looked promising but would probably be a bad idea), so I think I'll just make the Valiant better. I already know I need disc brakes and probably sway bars but I'm new to making these things handle. Can anyone provide pointers on which direction I should take and what I should get?
 
Slap in a Hotchkis TVS (total vehicle system), Upgrade your wheels (I like 16" but I think I'm the only one here that likes 16" wheels). Get some performance rubber.

That is a cost effective way of building solid cornering ability. You can buy the Hotchkis TVS all at once or a little at a time.

Other options are out there like replacing the entire front suspension/K-member with re designed units, at significantly more cost.


http://www.hotchkis.net/
 
Hotchkis? Nonsense. Google Mopar Action Green Brick. Nuff said.
 
1968FormulaS340 said:
Slap in a Hotchkis TVS (total vehicle system), Upgrade your wheels (I like 16" but I think I'm the only one here that likes 16" wheels). Get some performance rubber.

That is a cost effective way of building solid cornering ability. You can buy the Hotchkis TVS all at once or a little at a time.

Other options are out there like replacing the entire front suspension/K-member with re designed units, at significantly more cost.


http://www.hotchkis.net/
Click to expand...

It's more than I'd have at a given time but over time that's really not a bad option. Thanks. Here 16 and 15'' wheels are impossible to find here. Everything is 17-22" I saw someone put Cobra wheels on their Dart. Didn't look too bad.
 
I think sway bars and disc brakes would get me by when I get the engine in. I do know I'll need to do torsion bars too, so what thickness on those?
 
At least 1" I got mine for $188 from just suspension, discount code 'shopalizer'. Cheapest you'll find.


Your going to want to reinforce your k-member too. Look at my build pics.


Lastly, PM autoxcuda, ask him what hes done with stock suspensions. :finga:
 
Get with autoxcuda. His sheeot is badassary.
 
1.06 bars minimum (firmfeel)
Bilstien shocks
frame connectors
tubular upper control arms or offset upper bushings for more caster.
Freshen up all the bushings, rubber or poly.. your choice.
And as you mentioned discs and some modern rubber and you'll be amazed at the difference.
This is my current combo (I used urethane bushings). No anti sway bars yet, but its a great ride without them.
 
So many threads on this already...:violent1:

Completely rebuild the front suspension- poly or rubber is fine, just all new bushings/bearings. Moog 7103 offset bushings if you keep the stock UCA's.

Bigger torsion bars- 1" or more. 1" is fine on the street, bigger if its going to be an autocross or road race car

subframe connectors- every unibody should have these

new rear springs- lots of options here, but something in the 120- 130lb range is what you want

sway bars- front and rear. Anything is better than nothing, but Hotchkis and Hellwig are the best options for A-bodies

shocks- have to be matched to the big torsion bars. RCD Bilstein's or Fox

Brakes- disk up front, drum's are ok for the rear for most applications. The 11.75" Mopar disks are a great upgrade for stock parts and pretty cheap

Tires- Modern compounds are a must. That said, you'll need at least 17's to get that. 17's or 18's will work, do a search on rims and tire sizes. With a Valiant you can run 245/45/17's all the way around without major changes if you do your homework on rim width and backspace

All of that is a great start, and will give you a pretty good handling car if things are done right. You may also want to consider

-Seam welding the K member and boxing the steering mount
-Firm Feel steering box rebuild or a new Flaming river or Borgeson box
-Boxing the LCA's when you rebuild the suspension
-tubular UCA's. Not necessary, but if you already need to get big ball joint UCA's for a disk swap they're not much more than stock BBJ UCA's

Below are alignment specs to use with modern tires (stock specs are trash) and the instructions for the Moog 7103 bushings to get maximum caster.
 

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I am on a budget so I just need something that I can corner with and feel like I'm not going to die while doing it.
 
PoisonDart74 said:
At least 1" I got mine for $188 from just suspension, discount code 'shopalizer'. Cheapest you'll find.


Your going to want to reinforce your k-member too. Look at my build pics.


Lastly, PM autoxcuda, ask him what hes done with stock suspensions. :finga:
Click to expand...

RustyRatRod said:
Get with autoxcuda. His sheeot is badassary.
Click to expand...

:-\" :wave:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTT--mGlpTY"]Spring Fling Speed Festival 2011: '68 Barracuda "S" - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je5oeamQ_uw"]68 Barracuda Hotchkis TVS suspension cam - YouTube[/ame]

SUSPENSION

TORSION BARS: 1.14" 320 Lb./ft wheel rate stock .87" 109 Lb./ft, livable, pretty stiff, Hotchkis shocks were key to taming them.
REAR SPRINGS: Hotchkis. Weigh less that stock.
FRONT SWAY BAR: Hotchkis 1 1/4" hollow
REAR SWAY BAR: Hotchkis adjustable ¾" dia. hollow
SHOCKS: Hotchkis Bilstiens
STRUT RODS: Hotchkis tubular with heim ends. Precision articulation. Can set for nice bind-free LCA up and down movement. Holds poly LCA bushing against K-frame
A-ARMS: Hotckis Tubular. Able to dial in any caster desired.
SUBFRAME CONNECTORS: Hotchkis
73-76 K-member: reinforced
STEERING STEERING GEAR: Replacement Mopar remanufactured. Large steering gear spline, crisp, firmer, but not Firm Feel
PITMAN, IDLER, CENTERLINK: all ‘73-‘76 A-body, to accept large spline gear, Moog parts
POWER STEERING PUMP: Saginaw with rear oriface drilled out 1/64 larger. The other Mopar pump will not keep up with rapid steering input and are generally poor.
POWER STEERING FLUID: Justice Brothers heavy duty, don't change often, so extra cost is cheap assurance
POWER STEERING CAP: later style multi knobbed style with rubber baffle to stop spitting up.
 
justthatguy said:
I am on a budget so I just need something that I can corner with and feel like I'm not going to die while doing it.
Click to expand...

~ 1.00" t-bars...$200
front and rear sway bars... ~$300? Hellwig
HD gas shocks or KYB's... $150
moog 7104 offset upper control arm bushings $70

15x7 steel rims $100
225/60/15 tires
 
Dont see this suggested but in addition to stiff suspension parts, 17 or 18" wheels at 8 + " bead width, I suggest runing low profile strong sidewall tires, There is a big reason why all modern cars that handle have 2 total inches of sidewalls. Tire deflection is amazing to see in video, high sidewalls is a sad groping attempt at traction. Cobra rims and similar are a good mod it appears. Several threads on this site about upgrading to them. Requires a bit of work but not too much.
 
Reinforcing the k-frame when you lay down all this trick steering stuff is very important, these cars are notitious for crappy seam welds, times that by 40 years and sticky tires, recipe for disaster. Make sure you do that before you go play. At least the LCA pivot shafts and steering box area. A 1" bead around the perimeter ever 3" helps stiffen things up too. Might as well do the LCA's while your there. My build thread shows what to do, if you have any questions, pm us. It's about 30-40 worth of work if you've got clean everything and replace bushings and such.
 
ARE 'Ansen' rims are relatively low cost, strong, and wiegh less than the same size 'ralley' steel rims. You'll have look at some different brands (like Toyo) for good 15" tires, and you're not going to find the ultra-performance summer tires in 60 series. Tirerack is a good place to look online, but remember there are brands and models they don't carry. No Hekkappalittas, no bias ply Hoosiers for a couple of extreme examples.

Decide on your tires and wheels and build the rest of the program to match them. Generally I'd be encouraging front sway bar, good alignment, good shocks like Bilstein and the rest depends on its current condition and the tires and terrain. Anything you can do to reduce weight on the nose and get hieght down (unless you are off roading) will be a plus.
 
The debate over tire aspect ratio continues.......

The lower profile tires do have benefits, but the loss of sidewall flex can actually inhibit the tire contact with the road (contact patch). Some flexing of the sidewall will help maximize contact patch during extreme cornering. Lower profile tires tend to "slide" a bit more rather than grip. The higher sidewall tires also give you more turn-in bite than a short sidewall. The higher sidewall also is better at absorbing bumps and road anomolies (more flex and compliance).

All this said, I still prefer a shorter sidewall for my driving style. Yes it is a rougher ride, yes the nose can push more when entering a tight corner, I just prefer more of the controlled slides than the whip-bounce you tend to feel from the higher sidewalls. The pressure also tends to be more stable during a race with the shorter sidewalls (less change due to heat).
 
15" won't cut it, sidewall is too big, they don't really sell good sticky modern compound tires until 17".
Click to expand...

Really depends what he is doing. My mustang handles damn good with 15" rim/tires

If this is just a street cruiser keep it simple.

Make sure front end is in good shape. Convert to disc brake if that's what you want
1" bars
I like fresh leaf springs too. Xhd from espo will do
Good shocks.

Those few things will help big time.

Second stage could be.
Frame connectors
Front and rear sway bars.
 
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