David Vizard, Uncle Tony's garage, Unity motorsport. Mission impossible Dodge 302 Head porting

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Hysteric said:
Did that 10 pounds of epoxy make the ports bigger or smaller?
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It's not the bigger or smaller, it changed their shape. I wonder how much power that engine would've made with traditional port clean up and no epoxy, all else being the same?
 
What this thread shows how authoritarian peoples nature is it's all my way or the highway, no one has a each to their own mentality.
 
justinp61 said:
It's not the bigger or smaller, it changed their shape.
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The heads went from 152 cc to 145 cc.

273 said:
What this thread shows how authoritarian peoples nature is it's all my way or the highway, no one with a each to their own mentality.
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What it shows is peoples adherence to dogma in the face of contrary evidence.
 
justinp61 said:
Using the 2.2hp per cfm, does it matter if it's 300 cfm or 195?
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Nope. Look at Qwkmopardan who would have to be making 2 hp per cfm at least with his 587' headed 410 stroker.

I've come across many more that do the same. Different brands.
 
Hysteric said:
The heads went from 152 cc to 145 cc.


What it shows is peoples adherence to dogma in the face of contrary evidence.
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I'm talking about you too, I basically agree and disagree with most points being made in this thread. Depending on the context.

You can't bring yourself to admit that as impressive what
can be done with these 302 heads that 360/5.9l heads would be better starting pkace especially aftermarket, that there would few reasons not to do so.
 
273 said:
I'm talking about you too, I basically agree and disagree with most points being made in this thread. Depending on the context.

You can't bring yourself to admit that as impressive what
can be done with these 302 heads that 360/5.9l heads would be better starting pkace especially aftermarket, that there would few reasons not to do so.
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What you can do with less you can do with more.......
 
Hysteric said:
What you can do with less you can do with more.......
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Still really can't :) this why it's 34 pages and counting

Just like others can't accept this build don't interest them but it maybe to others.
 
justinp61 said:
Does the size matter if the desired flow is achieved?
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That's a very good question. I can't answer it definitively but from the examples I've come across i would imagine that might be the case within "reason".

There's more to an internal combustion engine than just airflow.
273 said:
Still really can't :) this why it's 34 pages and counting

Just like others can't accept this build don't interest them but it maybe to others.
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Nope. If you can use all that 195 cfm what happens when you use more..........
 
Charles used the 302 heads because they were the only Mopar heads that he had.


 
justinp61 said:
It's not the bigger or smaller, it changed their shape. I wonder how much power that engine would've made with traditional port clean up and no epoxy, all else being the same?
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Don't you dare mention the efficiency of that head went way up raising the floor so the port has a more direct path/shot into the cylinder. Preposterous to assume anything of the sort.
 
I tried to get through every page, but i had to skip a few, a lot of talk about the 302 heads and how much better they are, has anybody run a set of 302s and then a set of the 675s and know how much differance it made, like ETs at the track? I have personally done this experiment. And the 302s are not better.
 
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crackedback said:
Don't you dare mention the efficiency of that head went way up raising the floor so the port has a more direct path/shot into the cylinder. Preposterous to assume anything of the sort.
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Sort of like modern engines eh?
 
Hysteric said:
There's more to an internal combustion engine than just airflow.
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Technically yes but reality no, efficiency is relatively narrow especially in the engines were dealing with 1-1.5 lbs-ft per cid and generally it's much narrower for the majority of builds.
So air flow be it NA or power adder and NA gonna be ultimately through head flow.
Hysteric said:
Nope.
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Yup
 
crackedback said:
Don't you dare mention the efficiency of that head went way up raising the floor so the port has a more direct path/shot into the cylinder. Preposterous to assume anything of the sort.
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So they increased the efficacy of the port by making it smaller..........
 
Nope. Here it is again: If you can use all that 195 cfm what happens when you use more..........emphasis on "use" and "more".

What size did GTXJohn say his heads are cc wise that powers that 4000lbs wagon into the 11's again? With only .390 lift as well.

I still race a 318 small valve 302 4000Lb Aspen /Wagon with stock 390 lift cam and stock compression/
heads/manifold/ carb when I am not feeling good enough for the faster cars. I was shocked how well the stock 302 flowed compared to
my best 202 X heads up to max lift of 390 on the same bench even with the tiny valves (Hint: well over 200 CFMS's with the
right valve job.

The Wagon held the O/SA NHRA record @ 11.83 @ 109MPH. complete with Roof Race and Air Deflector
for years!
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273 said:
Technically yes but reality no, efficiency is relatively narrow especially in the engines were dealing with 1-1.5 lbs-ft per cid and generally it's much narrower for the majority of builds.
So air flow be it NA or power adder and NA gonna be ultimately through head flow.
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So when you throw a head that flows 240 cfm on that engine does that automatically make 480 HP?
 
Hysteric said:
Nope. Here it is again: If you can use all that 195 cfm what happens when you use more..........emphasis on "use" and "more".
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I get what your implying still not exactly saying, it's ok you don't have to say, not twisting your arm.
Hysteric said:
What size did GTXJohn say his heads are cc wise that powers that 4000lbs wagon into the 11's again? With only .390 lift as well.
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And?
Hysteric said:
So when you throw a head that flows 240 cfm on that engine does that automatically make 480 HP?
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No it takes the rest of the combo cam bore intake cr etc... But you throw on stock 318 heads will never make 480 hp NA no matter the rest of the combo is. The heads have the ultimate say how much power could be made if the rest is up to the task to extract max power.
 
10 lbs of epoxy made it 10lbs nose heavier. Like fake tits n lipo... if she still chokes n spits.. all the money mods dont matter! Your choice of head is only good within a limited range, ultimately power limited..and takes a ton of work and money to get to that point...that's great/ok if thats tour cup of tea.. the problem is YOU have trouble accepting others don't share the fondness beyond novelty mopar glory type of sentiment. It's actually kind of funny.. funny that you think we should all be wow over it and jump on this bandwagon with you. You actually seem hurt by us not doing so. The sarcasm,condescending replies... the snobbery is disgustingly atrocious at times.. but we know how excited you are.
So mr.braggard underdog ...why not a 273... why not a slant 6... its 2023 and you're telling us small is cool....so are you not capable of the same? ..or is it that you need someone else to do it for you and lay it all out.. Same exterior, marginal weight diff.. but so go smaller then, since being the underdog is your forte... brag to the heavens how you can do so much more with 273 cid..or 225.
Back to your train of thought... so heavily worked old iron for a 408 sb? or heavily worked 302 heads?
4 spd street car 3.91 gear 3100lbs.
Let's hear it
 
Hysteric said:
Nope. Here it is again: If you can use all that 195 cfm what happens when you use more..........emphasis on "use" and "more".
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A port don't flow 195 cfm's on the engine, that just telling you how restrictive that port is even if the engine displaces 800 cfm which is like a 460 peaking at 6000 ish rpm that only a 100 cfm's a cylinder but your gonna need a fairly big port and a lot of cfm @ 28" for a 460@ 6000 rpm even though the engines only displacing 800 cfm
 
273 said:
I get what your implying still not exactly saying, it's ok you don't have to say, not twisting your arm.

And?

No it takes the rest of the combo cam bore intake cr etc... But you throw on stock 318 heads will never make 480 hp NA no matter the rest of the combo is. The heads have the ultimate say how much power could be made if the rest is up to the task to extract max power.
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Yep. .390 lift and over 320 duration, the gear, con. You know I always go on a car Enthusiast site we're 95% of the people are on the street and never at the track and then go on about heads that when modified a ton and a bunch of money dumped into can take you to the elevens in stock Eliminator racing.
This guy was on a real forum were 95% of the people were Racers he would be stfu and not coming off like he is here.
His same old crap.. different thread.
 
MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Just state what the head being used is and stop using dead links. "about blank"
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It's a PDF link, I checked it, it's still active. It may be the browser or device you're using can't access or display it.
 
273 said:
No it takes the rest of the combo cam bore intake cr etc... But you throw on stock 318 heads will never make 480 hp NA no matter the rest of the combo is. The heads have the ultimate say how much power could be made if the rest is up to the task to extract max power.
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So that engine isn't using all that 240 cfm of flow? The Ultimate say is what you use. Those Underheaded combo's sure seem to punch above their weight and use all the airflow those engine receive. Here's an interesting aside Qwkmopardans 410 stroker with 587's makes what it makes with 28 degrees total timing.......

273 said:
And?
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125cc. That's even smaller than that 145 cc port. Still think a 318 needs a 160 cc port?

MOPAROFFICIAL said:
Yep. .390 lift and over 320 duration, the gear, con. You know I always go on a car Enthusiast site we're 95% of the people are on the street and never at the track and then go on about heads that when modified a ton and a bunch of money dumped into can take you to the elevens in stock Eliminator racing.
This guy was on a real forum were 95% of the people were Racers he would be stfu and not coming off like he is here.
His same old crap.. different thread.
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Its funny watching a daily driver street sedan that weighs at least 3400 LBS with a 318 and a tiny 218 hydraulic comp cam, stock converter and 3.23 gears run mid 12's with a 1.6xx 60 ft with only a stock valve sized 318 head.
 
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