Do you agree with this Hot Rod magazine online article quote?

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I think they are splittin hairs.
 
All depends on WHO is sleeving the block..as for the article i wouldn't waste the time or money sleeving a 318............
 
Doesn't sound worth it to sleeve any block with that type of damage. Seems to me if one cylinder had a .066" wall that eventually caused failure, another cylinder would likely do the same later down the line.
 
T56MaxTorq said:
Doesn't sound worth it to sleeve any block with that type of damage. Seems to me if one cylinder had a .066" wall that eventually caused failure, another cylinder would likely do the same later down the line.
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kinda like replacing both headlight bulbs at once
 
Well, I can tell you most very good expensive blocks are sleeved in every cylinder. Has zero to do with head bolt distortion. The better the block, the more HP sleeving it will make, depending on the sleeve.
And then there are coated sleeves, nikasil comes to mind...................so yes, done correctly, sleeves CAN make more HP.

As typical of a comic book, they only have part of th story correct.
 
T56MaxTorq said:
Doesn't sound worth it to sleeve any block with that type of damage. Seems to me if one cylinder had a .066" wall that eventually caused failure, another cylinder would likely do the same later down the line.
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I'd only do it if it was either a numbers matching block or a rare block aka hemi, max wedge
 
I came from motorcycle world where sleeving is very common. I'd sleeve every bore if I could afford it. And head bolt distortion is very real. I don't know if sleeving really fixes that though
 
"Back in the day" sleeves were the fastest way to get the most stable cylinder walls. That's where the pwoer is. Plate honing came out later, and if the sleeves are done right, there will still be distortion - just to a lesser degree. That's one of the reasons NHRA only allows(ed?) a maximum of seven sleeves in any EOM block. Race blocks use sleeves now for both strength and ability for easy repair.
So no BS. I agree 100%.
 
moper, one question: is it possible to sleeve all 8 holes in an engine block without loosing its strength? I always thought about bigger holes, 4.125" bore size for example without buying a siamese bore block....

Michael
 
With regard to sleeving blocks, lets not for get that they don't make our blocks any more, and as yards crush and scrap out our old cars, viable candidates go to the shredder to make room for new stuff. It will become that almost any block will be a golden find. You can see a parallel in cars now being restored that once were considered junk and not worth any ones time.
 
360duster said:
moper, one question: is it possible to sleeve all 8 holes in an engine block without loosing its strength? I always thought about bigger holes, 4.125" bore size for example without buying a siamese bore block....

Michael
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Darton Sleeve makes a kit for the 3rd Gen Hemi, scary to look at what they do, they make power with it.
 
Lots of top end guys with huge engines sleeve them (think sonny racing engines). Pretty common in the high end world.
 
JBurch said:
With regard to sleeving blocks, lets not for get that they don't make our blocks any more, and as yards crush and scrap out our old cars, viable candidates go to the shredder to make room for new stuff. It will become that almost any block will be a golden find. You can see a parallel in cars now being restored that once were considered junk and not worth any ones time.
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True but if that engine is say a 318 LA, that was made up till the 90s, there's no poin, now a 340 or any big block, yeah I could see that being a good idea
 
Agree. A steel sleeve is more stable than cast iron. I'll bet the higher end sleeved engines have only a 1 or 2% leakage at the most. A perfectly round cylinder without much expansion or deflection will make more power. When you're racing, a few horses could mean a win.
 
When done properly the sleeve basically becomes part of the block. They are a press fit and may be bonded chemically too. There is a minor loss of integrity in a normal water block, but it's really, really small and in factory cast Mopars, given the casting issues. I'd go out on the limb and say they are no weaker than any un-sleeved block when done properly given the OEM quality control issues and that "weakness" is offset by a much more stable cylinder wall.
 
moper said:
"Back in the day" sleeves were the fastest way to get the most stable cylinder walls. That's where the pwoer is. Plate honing came out later, and if the sleeves are done right, there will still be distortion - just to a lesser degree. That's one of the reasons NHRA only allows(ed?) a maximum of seven sleeves in any EOM block. Race blocks use sleeves now for both strength and ability for easy repair.
So no BS. I agree 100%.
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This.
 
My old machinist ran stock in G,H,I. He would sleeve all 8 cylinders for better ring seal.
 
dukeboy_318 said:
True but if that engine is say a 318 LA, that was made up till the 90s, there's no poin, now a 340 or any big block, yeah I could see that being a good idea
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You've missed the point.......old cars, trucks, are going to the shredder as fast as they can be loaded into trailers and hauled away. I live about 5-6 miles away from the largest privately owned shredder on the east coast....there is an endless stream of trucks hauling scrap to it. Who cares if something was made for 30 years......if a shredder goes 24/7 with the only time out to change hammers, doesn't take long to eat up 30 years of production.

Sleeveing a block like the one in the article, if that is all you can find, is what you will have to do. Don't dismiss that as a viable option.
 
I work in a machine shop, we sleeve blocks all the time. Sometimes all holes. The sleeve material is stronger than the block material, harder too. Nitrous and boosted motors keep race engine shops in business, lol. Aluminum blocks, iron blocks, CGI blocks; there's a lot of work dumped into the things to make them right before racing, you can't throw that away. And besides, many of these racers need their stuff "right now!"(often because of stupidity, cheapness and poor planning, but that's another story) so getting a new block isn't a option; if they're even available. S/F....Ken M
 
Cast iron is an easy way to make blocks with water passages that will last "long enough". It's not a wonder material, and being cast it's not even 100% dense.

Sleeves make an incredible amount of sense. Wrought materials are 100% dense, can be made of alloys which can be coated or heat treated to a wide range of properties, and will be FAR more consistent with respect to wall thicknesses and uniformity than any casting.

More power would be the result of the surface finishes and hardnesses that could not be attained in cast iron allowing for high performance ring packages and low friction coatings. There's also a reduction in the deformation seen in the walls under load, keeping more pressure in the cylinder and allowing for tunes closer to 'the edge' that wouldn't be as reliable on a less consistent platform. All those split hairs eventually add up to several hairs, and lots of races are won by a hair...

However, taking advantage of any of the benefits takes someone with a clue about manufacturing, engine design, and the effects of loading on the parts in question.
 
I have a 68 340 block that is .060 over and has a crack(and a hole) on one syl. i was planning on having that one cyl sleeve to get it back up and running. found a virgin 69 340 block with main caps. Swapped everything over. my latest motor is a 360 stroked. I cracked that 68 block, 30 years ago and i still have it! Someday it will be cheaper to sleeve all the syl then to find a good virgin block(for a 340 it's already here!!!!)
For bracket racing it would be a total waste of time and money. But someday it will be the economical way to go for me!!!!!
 
Just did a quick search, for my own thoughts with my block.
They still make a replacement block,
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(MOPAR 340 REPLACEMENT ENGINE BLOCK - NON-SIAMESE)
on sale now for $2995.00
Sleeving all 8 cylinders around $688....... That leave you (Me) with $2307.00 dollar worth of machine work, of the old block, before it would equal the price of a new block. that price don't include shipping for that heavy iron either!!!!!!!
For the original post/hot rod article, cheaper to fix one cyl,($87esh dollars) then to buy another 318 and then have it ALL re machined again.
 
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