Tie Rod Ends Hitting Torrsion Bars????

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MR4V

MR4V

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Hi All

Just about finsih with the rebuild on the Duster.
I have noticed that when there is no weight on the fornt end the inner tie rod end on the drivers side hits the torrsion bar & the passages side clears it. When the suspension is under load it hits some times, I'm yet to do a wheel alingment.
Is this normal when a wheel alingment has not been done?
The tie rods were in the car before the rebuild & cleared everything, I have doubled checked everything & the center link is in correctly.



 
I wish I knew why there are so many issues with the steering link. I've seen "hits oil pan" , "hits header" , " cant keep a good bushing in idler arm" , and more.
I don't think there is a huge difference in the 2 ends of the center link. A small difference might cause/cure your problem.
I can only wonder if a combination of non stock parts causes some of these problems. Forum members state "use C-body tie rod ends on A-body". Aftermarket offers fast ratio pitman and idler arms. Can both work together ? Who knows...
My puzzlement doesn't answer your question. I'm subscribed and wishing you a good answer though.
 
When I had my engine out they were real close to touching. Once the weight was put back, everything cleared fine. I do use the C-body tie rod ends with a V8 '73 center link and large sector steering box.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Many times when this issue has shown up the sleeve that goes through the K member has been broken loose.
Click to expand...

Which sleeve?

This suspension was in the car & worked well all I did was remove to powder coat.
Only change I did was go from drums to Wilwoods & I used FMJ spindles.
No change to pitman or idler arms.
I tried swaping the centre link around & then the Idler & pitman arms would not fit due to the tappered mounting holes.
I'm yet to do the wheel alingment.
 
Did you use the same torsion bars as before also? Same ride height? Seems odd to me too, I will be watching, and I'm going to check my cars to see how close they are.
 
No flipping the bar over will not work. Switching ends left to right could work but may not make a difference.
The C-body tie rod ends do have the same tapered ball stud as A-body.
Most owners don't notice the cup of that casting is deeper than A-body casting.
Deeper equals taller. That doesn't matter in some applications because the cup lands on the bottom.
 
It has the wrong center link in the car. Or the wrong pitman/idler arms on it. My 68 GTS which was never touched till I got it has the center link that the tie rod hole is facing foward not up. I just ran out side with the camera and looked.
I think they used different center links for slant or v8 but not 100% on that. My parts books are packed up right now getting ready for a move so I can't look. Maybe someone can chime in on that.
Here's the pic of mine.
 
MR4V's is the '73-up center link. mr68gts is the 67-72 type. I have the older style on my '71 Scamp as well, with a-body tie rod ends. Yet mine looks like the passenger side is closer than the driver side. These pics I took a while ago, and the front end is jacked up so no weight on the front end.

Now I'll have to go out and check more closely! Mine has had an alignment and I never noticed anything hitting.

IMG_20130824_002045.jpg


IMG_20130824_002055.jpg
 
MR4V said:
Which sleeve?

This suspension was in the car & worked well all I did was remove to powder coat.
Only change I did was go from drums to Wilwoods & I used FMJ spindles.
No change to pitman or idler arms.
I tried swaping the centre link around & then the Idler & pitman arms would not fit due to the tappered mounting holes.
I'm yet to do the wheel alingment.
Click to expand...


Since we have seen variations on export cars anything below could apply so you will have to judge for yourself.


I don't know what combination you are running or if an export car might be different than US cars but your pitman arm isn't going in the center link from the right direction when compared to ours. On our cars there is no way that the pitman arm would fit that direction in the center link unless someone had modified the center link.

US 1973 up diagram.

attachment.php


US 1972 back diagram.

attachment.php


I am not saying that you have a busted sleeve for sure is what you have for sure but the similarities are there. Reading the link below might help you figure out what is going on as it shows the 73 up assembly in great details.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=160746

INTERESTING SIDE NOTE: Australia has been the only source found so far for the longer wheel studs for the small bolt pattern Kelsey Hayes brakes.
 
Look at the other photos. Your center link makes the inner tie rod end angle up at a angle and everybody elses points straight foreward. Looks like you may have the wrong center link if it can't be flipped end-for-end because of the taper. tmm
 
I didn't realize there were different center links for later years. There is definately something up or a mix mash of parts from previous owner. After reading the whole link posted, I'd start at the k member and work back from there. Check the sleeve in the K member and the torsion mount at the rear. I had a problem with mine that the pivot shaft for the arm was messed up due to the PO hitting a curb. It also split the lower control arm on that side causing the sleeve in the arm to be out of whack. This is not the case for you but just to show how one thing can make it all caddy wompas. It's probably an easy find without all the front end components in there hiding things. May not be such an easy fix however, but it can all be fixed.
Paul
 
toolmanmike said:
Look at the other photos. Your center link makes the inner tie rod end angle up at a angle and everybody elses points straight foreward. Looks like you may have the wrong center link if it can't be flipped end-for-end because of the taper. tmm
Click to expand...

EDIT Misread your post mike--------- The difference here is late versus early, When using the later or early, you must match the pitman, the idler, and the center link. Otherwise they simply will not fit, period.

Here:

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=236925

Someone mentioned worn LCA pivot. I would thing the LCA bushing itself might do this if bad enough
 
You have the wrong center link with the pitman and idler you are using. You have a 73 and up big bolt center link with a 72 on back pitman and Idler. You need to get the correct matching parts for your car. I have seen this many times . And most of the guys on here will have you bending and welding things that is not needed. Just get the correct matching parts for your car . Steve, I have them if needed.
 
You Did say it hasn't been aligned which will affect ride hight and angles. That MAY be the problem.
 
You can lift that car 10 foot . It's not going to move the center link away from the Torsion bar or K-member. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what is wrong here. WRONG COMBINATION OF PARTS> And thats a fact.
 
Oldmanmopar said:
You can lift that car 10 foot . It's not going to move the center link away from the Torsion bar or K-member. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what is wrong here. WRONG COMBINATION OF PARTS> And thats a fact.
Click to expand...

Yes, the '73-up pitman stud will go in from the top, facing down. His is the older year going from the bottom up, but with a '73-up center link. Get a '73-up pitman arm and it'll probably lower than whole tie rod end down some. That's why the driver side is really off, and the passenger/idler arm side is not as bad. However I bet your idler arm likely needs to be changed to '73-up as well.
 
some pics for reference you can see the difference in the links laying on the mat in front of the suspensions
 

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Oldmanmopar said:
In order to use the link he has. It is installed up side down for the beveled holes to fit.
Click to expand...

Is this car a RHD Australia or a LHD American manufactured car? I am thinking LHD but between the pictures, my small laptop screen and my poor eye sight I am not sure.

That would be 100% correct if it is an American manufactured car. Who knows for sure since it might be an Australian manufactured or an export car where some thing is different. There has been quite a few differences noted over the years between cars made elsewhere such as the Australian hemi 6 that we never had.
 
Oklacarcollecto said:
Is this car a RHD Australia or a LHD American manufactured car? I am thinking LHD but between the pictures, my small laptop screen and my poor eye sight I am not sure.

That would be 100% correct if it is an American manufactured car. Who knows for sure since it might be an Australian manufactured or an export car where some thing is different. There has been quite a few differences noted over the years between cars made elsewhere such as the Australian hemi 6 that we never had.
Click to expand...

The OP's car in the first post is a LHD car, just like a US car (Even though he's "down under"). You can see the Steering Box near the top of the first picture.

The bare aluminum finish visible on the bottom of the steering box mounting pad/foot makes me think it's a Manual Steering Box (possibly converted to Manual Steering, if it was, chances are it was from a pre-73, hence the incorrect pitman arm).
 
Well Im looking at this post after nights sleep & I had know idea what I started.

These parts are the ones that were in the 73 Duster & I was driving it for 6 mths before I decided to give it a clean up.
The Pitman & Ider arms were never replaced, so if its missed match parts why didn't do it before?

Oldmanmopar said:
You can lift that car 10 foot . It's not going to move the center link away from the Torsion bar or K-member. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what is wrong here. WRONG COMBINATION OF PARTS> And thats a fact.
Click to expand...
 
Post 11 even shows a FSM exploded view to show you... I don't know why its worse now, possably wear/flex in the lower control arm pin, or bushing, but you have MISMATCHED parts.. easy fix
 
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