Any 10 second "All Throttle" 318's in door cars ?

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This thread reminded me of the local guy with a Scamp racecar that was really fast. I was told that he was running a 318. Unfortunately, I don't have any info on the car. Not even sure the guy is still around, pretty sure the car got sold 20+ years ago.

I've always like the idea of doing more with less. And I like a high revving motor. Because of that, the idea of a fast 318 has always intrigued me. But I don't have the funds/time/space to do much more than daydream and read what other's do.

Trick for me is that I don't have a lot of use for a race only motor, so it would have to be workable on the street. Which (to me) means deep gears and lot's of splits in the trans to boost low end torque and yet keep RPM's down on the highway. Seems like the perfect place to finally see an 8HP70 behind an LA.

Sorry I can't add to the recipes or post something constructive.
 
DionR said:
This thread reminded me of the local guy with a Scamp racecar that was really fast. I was told that he was running a 318. Unfortunately, I don't have any info on the car. Not even sure the guy is still around, pretty sure the car got sold 20+ years ago.

I've always like the idea of doing more with less. And I like a high revving motor. Because of that, the idea of a fast 318 has always intrigued me. But I don't have the funds/time/space to do much more than daydream and read what other's do.

Trick for me is that I don't have a lot of use for a race only motor, so it would have to be workable on the street. Which (to me) means deep gears and lot's of splits in the trans to boost low end torque and yet keep RPM's down on the highway. Seems like the perfect place to finally see an 8HP70 behind an LA.

Sorry I can't add to the recipes or post something constructive.
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I really don't have a purpose or use for a "race engine" either. But I have parts just "laying here and there" and thought they could sit just as well be bolted together as in different places... Ha! I would put it in a Duster for a year just to toy with it. Then, it would most likely be pulled.
 
318willrun said:
I really don't have a purpose or use for a "race engine" either. But I have parts just "laying here and there" and thought they could sit just as well be bolted together as in different places... Ha! I would put it in a Duster for a year just to toy with it. Then, it would most likely be pulled.
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And that's a great reason. Wasn't trying to take anything away from what or why you are thinking about this. Just saying that when I start daydreaming about those ideas I end up with "modifiers" like "has to be streetable". But that's just my situation and desires, not suggesting they should influence yours.

That said, a high RPM 318 putting out 450+ HP, with EFI to calm it down some and a double OD or better trans seems like a really killer deal to me. Good parts, low tension rings, high compression, roller cam, high flow heads, tunnel ram with port injectors and a TB, and an 8HP70 or T56 would make for just a cool ride. Ah, if only I could snap my fingers and make it happen.
 
318willrun said:
I really don't have a purpose or use for a "race engine" either. But I have parts just "laying here and there" and thought they could sit just as well be bolted together as in different places... Ha! I would put it in a Duster for a year just to toy with it. Then, it would most likely be pulled.
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Define “race engine” as that makes a huge difference.
 
Rat Bastid said:
Define “race engine” as that makes a huge difference.
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I know you didn't quote me, but I was the one that prompted him to make that statement.

I guess in the simplest terms, to me a "race engine" would be something built with the narrow focus of track use only.

Since I started the tangent, I though it was fair to clarify what I was thinking of.
 
I think with E85 now available to most and considered street fuel it opened up the building of higher compression engines. I have no problem using an 8 inch converter in a street build and know many who run one. Caltracks and Micky Thompson street radials fix most traction issues. A .550-.620 roller cam would probably be my go to with a set of ported Speedmaster or Edelbrock heads flowing 285-300cfm in the usable lift range. Because of the high stall a ported Victor340 and a 750-850 Holley carb. Safely in around 11.5-1 compression and Scat rods. The smart build would probably have a 904 transmission and 4.10 gears. I’m not much of a windage tray guy but for a street build it would require a different type of pan than I am used to so more attention would be spent on drainback and windage issues. Standard oil pump gently massaged for a starting point.
 
33IMP said:
I completely understand the point of this thread. I just think that if tens are the goal (which 318wr pointed out his is not) common sense says there's better/cheaper/easier ways to do it.
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Agreed. For the record, I wasn’t lashing out. Just saying for the masses who always live to say to bigger or stroke it when it’s not on the table to do so or topic there within.
Being down 22, 42 cubes just makes it more challenging. Ever mind a strokers final displacement.

I like the idea of the challenge.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Agreed. For the record, I wasn’t lashing out. Just saying for the masses who always live to say to bigger or stroke it when it’s not on the table to do so or topic there within.
Being down 22, 42 cubes just makes it more challenging. Ever mind a strokers final displacement.

I like the idea of the challenge.
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Agreed. It's COOL to say I've got a 500hp 318, or a 500hp 292, but I'll bet neither is cheap. I'm CHEAP, but I've got a 500hp 406. I can't afford a 500hp 292, OR 318.
 
33IMP said:
490 ft/lb with a stock stroke 318? That i would like to see (HARD to believe).
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Ya no way that's right thats over 1.5 lbs-ft per cid, that's Nascar build territory, average guy type build your doing good if your above 1.2:1.
 
33IMP said:
I completely understand the point of this thread. I just think that if tens are the goal (which 318wr pointed out his is not) common sense says there's better/cheaper/easier ways to do it.
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I don't really get the cost and hardness factor, most 408 builds are stock block and aftermarket everything else and a similar 360 build might use stock crank too, other than possible piston cost,
What so difficult and or more expensive for the parts for a 318 build ?
 
273 said:
I don't really get the cost and hardness factor, most 408 builds are stock block and aftermarket everything else and a similar 360 build might use stock crank too, other than possible piston cost,
What so difficult and or more expensive for the parts for a 318 build ?
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Pistons are the only expensive cost factor next to the cylinder head you want to run ether OOTB or ported.
 
rumblefish360 said:
Pistons are the only expensive cost factor next to the cylinder head you want to run ether OOTB or ported.
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But really is the cylinder head choice for most of these type builds be trick flow or ported eddy or similar, people act like 318 will need something like port W8 and trick nacar level build for 450-500hp I don't get it.
 
Dartswinger70 said:
No need for your bullshit I was just simply stating a fact. asshole
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Didn't mean to upset ya, just sick of this turning every thread into a tony bashing thread or seems like it lately anyways.
 
DionR said:
I know you didn't quote me, but I was the one that prompted him to make that statement.

I guess in the simplest terms, to me a "race engine" would be something built with the narrow focus of track use only.

Since I started the tangent, I though it was fair to clarify what I was thinking of.
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I appreciate your views. But, they are your views. I would suggest what I think is a race engine is far different than what you’d consider.

In fact, I suspect that what I call a basic street/strip (with very little focus on the strip part) engine would probably fall into your definition of a race engine.

And that’s the problem with every discussion of this type.

I don’t consider anything under 12:1 a race engine. That’s pump gas territory.

I think if you are building a street/strip engine and you aren’t at .580 lift you are pissing power away.

A 9 inch converter is a STREET/strip converter. Not a race piece.

IMO, the 4.56 may be the PERFECT street/strip gear.

So it can be clearly seen when guys start talking about 10’s and “street” I have to laugh, as some of those guys think the Air Gap is the best street/strip intake ever. It’s not. Not even close IF you understand what you are doing with a Strip Dominator. It will KILL the AG all day long.

Again, just my opinions but I have been doing this **** since 1980 and I’ve spent way too much of my life at dragstrips, circle tracks, MX **** to know what doesn’t work.
 
Rat Bastid said:
I appreciate your views. But, they are your views. I would suggest what I think is a race engine is far different than what you’d consider.
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Yep, just different views. And I can respect and appreciate your views as well.

Rat Bastid said:
In fact, I suspect that what I call a basic street/strip (with very little focus on the strip part) engine would probably fall into your definition of a race engine.
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You are probably right. I know my threshold is far lower than some (most?).

All comes down to what someone wants out of their car.
 
My 318 went 11.70s in street/strip Duster, i drove it to the track, 9.4 comp 10 inch conv Edelbrock heads no work done to them, if i work on the car more, i could have gone 11.50s, the same car with a iron headed 360, after i did work on the car, went 10.60s, i think with some compression and a good cam and gear. A 318 would be able to run 10s no problem.
 
DionR said:
Yep, just different views. And I can respect and appreciate your views as well.



You are probably right. I know my threshold is far lower than some (most?).

All comes down to what someone wants out of their car.
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EXACTLY. That’s why I always ask what someone’s definition of “…” whatever is so you can see what they want, what they can live with, what they can tolerate and what they can’t live with.

Back in the day, it wasn’t usual to have an engine idle speed of 1400 RPM. It never bothered me (it would drive me bat crap crazy today though because cams have gotten so much better, plus I’m a much better tuner than I was then) but some guys would literally lose it with that idle speed.

So I would do a bit of tuning, unplug the tach and make them drive it. Once they signed off on it, I’d hook the tach back up and the vast majority of them would go berserk. So you turn the idle down and let it struggle.

Thats one of those things you have to find out about people. And then verify it, because most guys think they can handle more then they really can.
 
Rat Bastid said:
I appreciate your views. But, they are your views. I would suggest what I think is a race engine is far different than what you’d consider.

In fact, I suspect that what I call a basic street/strip (with very little focus on the strip part) engine would probably fall into your definition of a race engine.

And that’s the problem with every discussion of this type.

I don’t consider anything under 12:1 a race engine. That’s pump gas territory.

I think if you are building a street/strip engine and you aren’t at .580 lift you are pissing power away.

A 9 inch converter is a STREET/strip converter. Not a race piece.

IMO, the 4.56 may be the PERFECT street/strip gear.

So it can be clearly seen when guys start talking about 10’s and “street” I have to laugh, as some of those guys think the Air Gap is the best street/strip intake ever. It’s not. Not even close IF you understand what you are doing with a Strip Dominator. It will KILL the AG all day long.
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Very true, everyone has a different opinion on what they are willing to tolerate in a street engine. I will say two things about this thread:
  • This thread was designed to see what is out there for "wild-throttled" 318's. I didn't want to attract the 500 eddy carbed/360 2bbl cam 318's. If someone wants to say how they would build one, that's fine too. However, a 10 second street Duster really isn't my goal. It would be whatever it ran, it ran.
  • As I posted above, this engine would be a collaboration of mostly "parts on hand". I don't care how street friendly it is just so it does run on pump gas.
 
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