Ritter block is still a pipe dream....Why doesn't Ritter get it to final assembly state ( installing rotating assembly ).. .. and then put a price on it .... more like 3500-4000 dollars ... which will then be the determining factor to move to bigblock , end of story ... just sayin...
Ritter 59 degree iron block
- Thread starter rrvolare
- Start date
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yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
This is why it won't survive.
I know you are looking for an X or R block and I have my eyes and ears on one for you as well. If, you find one, that's a big IF, I'd say expect 1500-2000 dollars for an unmolested one. Mine is a 2 bolt cap so I left in and used studs. So I had to.....bore, hone deck, line hone, size the lifter bores, tube the oil gallery.
None of that is cheap. That's the way it is. How do you expect someone to build a block with the EXACT dimensions you need? How will he know the diameter of your crank? How tall should he make the decks? What bore size, if you don't have the Pistons?
None of this is cheap. Not sure why Ritter won't make blocks with the 2 standard lifter locations and standard cam bearing bores. Maybe he does.
But everything else should be rough finished and the machinist should finish that stuff to his specs.
Lustle
Well-Known Member
Why do you say that?
The engine I know of that was built, was just over 20G (canadian) all said and done. Yes. That's expensive. But its an over 800 horse all aluminum small block. Naturally aspirated.
Look at other crate engine offerings. Chevy? Sure you can get 700+ horse engine from them too. Also 20 grand. Blue print? They make a supercharged engine making 750 horse, also 20 grand. Edelbrock, yup 20g. Pretty much anything close to 800 horse is 20g. And that's chevy. We know how lucky those guys are for how cheap everything is. What about ford? I couldn't find any crate engines (quick summit look) that made over 600 horse. Typical lol.
So really. It's not that out there. Gotta pay to play.
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
IDK, I can tell you by looking at MPH that there ain't many 800 HP big block any things out there.
If you have 800 HP in a 3000 pound car, you are looking at a 9.1x-9.2x deal.
Lots of guys THINK they have *** HP but the MPH says they don't.
And a stock BB at 800 is a small tuning error from being junk. Plus, ring seal is horrendous, bearing life is limited because you can't keep the main line straight in them. It's not as easy as you think.
There are guys with hair dryers that are making good power but the hair dryer is fairly easy on parts. N/A 800 HP is going to kill th block in fairly short order.
Lustle
Well-Known Member
I don't think BB would be cheaper. Look at big als toybox. 505CI, blown, 770 horse. Also 20 grand. Or even check out MRL here. Makes a 730+ horse 470 stroker. I think he mentioned 17-18k for that setup. And don't get me wrong. It's a great setup. And thats on iron heads, so there is more there. But still, gotta pay to play!
The tuning thing is not wrong. And with the stroke needed on a big block, piston speed at higher RPM to make that kinda power becomes a serious concern to me. Do you REALLY want a piston traveling 4.5 inches at sayyyyy 7000 RPM? Which is why power adders are great on them. Local guy here runs 7.70's in his big block twin blower setup. Slick car.
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
Lustle hits the nail right on the head when ut comes to pay to play and for reference on the prices 20k cdn is like 13k us .call Ray Barton and see what 13k buys ya from his shop .Now if we can see these blocks get to where they are in stock items instead of special order we may see the wholesale price get down to where 20kcdn gets you a SB Victor headed aluminum blocked stroker making well in excess of 800hp na and 1200hp+ with a blower or hair dryer yeehaw buddy .
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
You know if a couple of builders got together with a couple of us punters we could probably put together a pretty good sized group buy .I wonder what we could do on the price and base level machining if we bought 20 or 30 or more ? Might be worth it to by 5 each and then use that saving to resell ready to build blocks .How about it builders ? I might be talked into pitching in for 4 or 5 if the price was right and I could parlay that investment into a Victor headed motor like that .
Brian Hafliger
Well-Known Member
Anyone is free to call Kent and discuss pricing. The blocks are roughly 3150.00 unfinished...meaning you need to finish: Cam tunnel mains, line hone, final bore, decking, drain backs if necessary, lifter bores (either finish them as they are undersize from him, or bushings). You also must run an external line from the oil filter base area to the front china wall to take advantage of priority main oiling in addition to running lines for the relocated oil filter. You must also mill the rear main cap to align the hole with the oil pump hole.
I don't see how anyone could claim 2900.00 spent on this...and I know for a fact Kent can have the machine work finished for you if you don't have someone that can but I don't know the quality. And it'll be at least 1800+ I'm betting and not done on a cnc although that's not always necessary if the initial block machining is correct.
Brian
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
Wow $5k US is a far cry from $2900 , no wonder this guy can't get any traction with these . I've been drooling over them for years now but every time it seems like he's got it figured out it ends up being an unfinished product that practically doubles in price by the time it is finished .
There you go... spoken from one of the Masters...4950 and a strong possibility more to get the block anywhere near for final assembly....add another roughly 2000 for the FORGED rotating assembly and you are at 6950...
Brian... i think what needs to be done ... from a respectable/good builder from you or Mike at MRL is to complete a RITTER short block ( 408 ot 416 whatever ) top to bottom and front to rear .. then there will be NO questions on what it would take for this RITTER block to work ...this way we can put the hopes and dreams of the RITTER block to rest .. and move on...
People are hoping for this block to come down in price ... from what i here now .. it started at 2900 and now is at 3150??? Just for the block.. only way from here is UP ... Thanks
Brian... i think what needs to be done ... from a respectable/good builder from you or Mike at MRL is to complete a RITTER short block ( 408 ot 416 whatever ) top to bottom and front to rear .. then there will be NO questions on what it would take for this RITTER block to work ...this way we can put the hopes and dreams of the RITTER block to rest .. and move on...
People are hoping for this block to come down in price ... from what i here now .. it started at 2900 and now is at 3150??? Just for the block.. only way from here is UP ... Thanks
Exactly Cannuky ... you try and get a few guys now to go in on this to drop the price per block ....LOL.. NO way in Frickin hell are these going to take off at that price .... i hate to keep brining up brand X... but i was told a smallblock FORD DART block capable of 1000 HP + with rotating assembly around $4000 ???? These RITTERS would be FLYING OFF the shelf ................at that price ... Lower the anchor ....
cannucky
The Guy With No Birthday
Yep even finished ready to build for $2900us=$4100cdn would be borderline good enough for me but 5kus is $6800cdn today -NFW not happening .And we haven't even tacked on the shipping and border tax I'd be looking at close to 9kcdn for one at todays rate , Brian built and shipped my 410 complete for less than that .
Brian Hafliger
Well-Known Member
What you guys seem to be missing is that this block is for SERIOUS racing only, or anyone who doesn't mind spending the $$$ for a block that can handle and even help create big power. And since there are NO aftermarket blocks available right now, this is it for a while so at least there IS a block available.
If you need or want it, it's there to be had...if not pass it up. Very cut and dry. I believe someday someone will cast blocks again that will fill the need for 600-800HP small blocks but it won't be in the next 2-4 years from what I can see.
Just as a side note, if you bought an R3 right now from Indy, (they only have water blocks, no Siamese bore blocks anymore) they are 3800.00....if you include shipping, and machine work you'll be quite close to the same cost as the Ritter without the capability of a large bore/large (60mm) cam tunnel and no priority main oiling...so until we can get blocks for the masses in the 3000. neighborhood this is what sb guys are stuck with...or we can do aluminum block BB's for even more $$$! Right now is a bitter sweet time for Mopar guys...more cylinder heads than ever and NO affordable blocks to bolt them to. But if people keep complaining eventually someone will get the ball rolling once again.
If you need or want it, it's there to be had...if not pass it up. Very cut and dry. I believe someday someone will cast blocks again that will fill the need for 600-800HP small blocks but it won't be in the next 2-4 years from what I can see.
Just as a side note, if you bought an R3 right now from Indy, (they only have water blocks, no Siamese bore blocks anymore) they are 3800.00....if you include shipping, and machine work you'll be quite close to the same cost as the Ritter without the capability of a large bore/large (60mm) cam tunnel and no priority main oiling...so until we can get blocks for the masses in the 3000. neighborhood this is what sb guys are stuck with...or we can do aluminum block BB's for even more $$$! Right now is a bitter sweet time for Mopar guys...more cylinder heads than ever and NO affordable blocks to bolt them to. But if people keep complaining eventually someone will get the ball rolling once again.
Lustle
Well-Known Member
This was my point. Yes, it's expensive. Yes the block needs a lot of work. But if you are going all out, it's your only choice. And in the end, it's not that expensive compared to other brands for what you end up doing. 800+ horse for those prices? Well once again, gotta pay to play.
Brian we get it ..... thats all we got ... 2-4 more years for an affodable MOPAR small block ... which typically means 5-6 years .....at the rate in which HP is moving towards fuel injection these days .... same thing is going to happen to MOPARS that has been happening to CHEVY ( more people building LS motors/blocks with power adders ) , and now is happening to FORD.( coyote motors ) ....factory "BLOCKS "that can handle 1000 + HP ...Affordable Mopar shortblocks OLD LA engines needs to happen NOW ....
I bet DART develops an LA block which is afforsable before somebody else does ..... HMM there is a thought ... Mr Ritter needs to make a deal with DART to procuce the blocks ???????JEGs :
372 Dart shortblock forged internals > $4,322.80
347 Dart shorblock forged internals > $4,617.71
Ritter >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>roughly > $6950 +
Brian thanks for all you have done to the MOPAR world ...
I bet DART develops an LA block which is afforsable before somebody else does ..... HMM there is a thought ... Mr Ritter needs to make a deal with DART to procuce the blocks ???????JEGs :
372 Dart shortblock forged internals > $4,322.80
347 Dart shorblock forged internals > $4,617.71
Ritter >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>roughly > $6950 +
Brian thanks for all you have done to the MOPAR world ...
superbeesrt8
Well-Known Member
There is a guy working on bringing back the R3 block he has found all the old molds and the the guy who did all the work on the R block working on a deal with mopar I read this on W7-8-9 facebook page this will be great if it all works out
yellow rose
Overnight Sensation
This is my point. I have built many engines that ain't chryslers and I NEVER, not ONCE, EVER took a block and put parts in it. Every single one of them was surfaced, lined honed, lifters bores checked and fitted, oiling system mods (when required) all the standard stuff.
Brand X and brand F take just as much work to finish as anything else.
I don't know a single engine builder buying blocks and slapping them together. That ain't the real world. It only happens in magazines and TV shows.
This is absolutely true. The SBC is quickly becoming obsolete. An LS can be built for the same price, be bulletproof, get mileage, and adapt seemlessly to the newer transmissions. Anybody looking to go old school can build a 600"+ BBC for cheap now. The coyote is a ways off from being affordable for the average guy. Many Ford guys are swapping LS's or even going BBF. You can build a roller 557" BBF with Kasse P51's pretty cheap now a days.
Unfortunately there are many guys like me in the Mopar community nowadays. The guys who are looking to build a 500hp car are covered, and the guys looking to break records are covered. The 600+hp guy that wants to play with Camaros and Mustangs is kinda screwed though.
I get that ... we get that .. the whole world FRICKIN gets that , blocks need some work prior to final assembly?????..... BUT again .....it is the amount of MONEY needed to get to final assembly.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ ..
SuperbeeSRT8- that is FANTASTIC news.... but if there were R3 blocks being reproduced wouldn't we be in the exact same postion with the RITTER blocks ??? HP RITTER Blocks are available ... they are just such a piece of ****that they require ALOT of finish work ... THE FINAL answer is that we need somebody to manufacturer a block cheaper to compete with FORD AND CHEVY block prices ...
Like Cannuky stated earlier ... back to the drawing board means >>>> the final price of the block alone keeps going up and up and up ....
NOW if RITTER Keeps the block price at 2900 ....and all that needs to be done is MINIMAL work to get to assembly state ... then its a winner ...
2900 + 2000 (forge rotating assembly ) + 500 machine and labour= 5400 ( short block ) that would make it somewhat competitive ...
372 Dart shortblock forged internals > $4,322.80 CHEVY
347 Dart shorblock forged internals > $4,617.71 FORD
Ritter >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>roughly > $5400 ( $6950 + RITTER ) FIAT/chrysler
SuperbeeSRT8- that is FANTASTIC news.... but if there were R3 blocks being reproduced wouldn't we be in the exact same postion with the RITTER blocks ??? HP RITTER Blocks are available ... they are just such a piece of ****that they require ALOT of finish work ... THE FINAL answer is that we need somebody to manufacturer a block cheaper to compete with FORD AND CHEVY block prices ...
Like Cannuky stated earlier ... back to the drawing board means >>>> the final price of the block alone keeps going up and up and up ....
NOW if RITTER Keeps the block price at 2900 ....and all that needs to be done is MINIMAL work to get to assembly state ... then its a winner ...
2900 + 2000 (forge rotating assembly ) + 500 machine and labour= 5400 ( short block ) that would make it somewhat competitive ...
372 Dart shortblock forged internals > $4,322.80 CHEVY
347 Dart shorblock forged internals > $4,617.71 FORD
Ritter >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>roughly > $5400 ( $6950 + RITTER ) FIAT/chrysler
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