Highest flowing sbm heads?

[turbodart68]

Thats exactly what you said and if you really believe that you are full of ****.

Explain how two heads can flow the same air at the same depression and one head is 40 HP up on the other.

I have personally taken heads ported by other people and ended up with LESS flow that made MORE power on LESS fuel.

So explain your theory.

Telling people flow is everything is a fools errand. And I’ve explained why that is many times.

I meant a good running N/A motor makes a good running boosted motor. So a good head is very important to a boosted motor. N/A guys always say “oh its easy to make power with boost” actually its not. Yes you can force a crappy air pump to move air with a ton of boost. I don’t know what your problem is but your delivery sucks. So I am clarifying because there are people here who want to learn. Furthermore, if you took the time to read my other posts you would see that I said that flow is only about 20% of the equation. It really makes you look bad when you immediately jump on somebody without reading the thread.

 

[turbodart68]

W2’s make for a great head for a stock block stroker motor. With a little porting they can make north of 600 pretty easily. The one thing I recommend with any of the offset rocker heads is a solid roller cam with the offset lifter. It really helps with intake geometry. If you can afford it Jesel makes rockers for them and it would make for reliable power. I have harland sharps on mine and its like glass. It breaks adjusters occasionally and is generally a pain in the but. The harland sharps are 900 and the Jesels are 1600 so thats an easy yes for me.

 

[67autocross]

Same secret facility that was working over your Shockers?

Yeah same guy doing the porting...I bet he put 100 hours into my shockers...

 

[Rat Bastid]

I meant a good running N/A motor makes a good running boosted motor. So a good head is very important to a boosted motor. N/A guys always say “oh its easy to make power with boost” actually its not. Yes you can force a crappy air pump to move air with a ton of boost. I don’t know what your problem is but your delivery sucks. So I am clarifying because there are people here who want to learn.

What does that have to do with your claim that flow is everything? Those were YOUR words.

As for my delivery that’s on you. I don’t have time to play with adults who think and act like children.


If you think making power with boost is hard you have no business trying to make power NA. You wouldn’t have the stomach for it.

 

[turbodart68]

You have no clue about what you are talking about. It shows in your replies. You don’t know me or have any idea of what I have done because you are too arrogant to look nor are you smart enough to read posts and comprehend what some is saying. I don’t post here often because of dipshits like you. I used to help people here often back in the day when people were cool. Not so much anymore. So today you win the internet yay you. So kindly go crawl back into your moms basement. Dont both replying on my behalf, I wont see it. Blocked.

 

[Rat Bastid]

You have no clue about what you are talking about. It shows in your replies. You don’t know me or have any idea of what I have done because you are too arrogant to look nor are you smart enough to read posts and comprehend what some is saying. I don’t post here often because of dipshits like you. I used to help people here often back in the day when people were cool. Not so much anymore. So today you win the internet yay you. So kindly go crawl back into your moms basement. Dont both replying on my behalf, I wont see it. Blocked.

Nice. Blocked by another crybaby. Later dude.

 

[318willrun]

Isn't this where the Gen III Hemi can come into play?? The block is strong! And the heads are pretty good as well. And, it's a small block mopar. Wouldn't it be cheaper to obtain 600 hp at a much lesser cost on all motor ?? 6.4 is a monster with just a cam swap - carb intakes out there too. Holley really supports the GenIII hemi swaps

 

[toolmanmike]

Isn't this where the Gen III Hemi can come into play?? The block is strong! And the heads are pretty good as well. And, it's a small block mopar. Wouldn't it be cheaper to obtain 600 hp at a much lesser cost on all motor ?? 6.4 is a monster with just a cam swap - carb intakes out there too. Holley really supports the GenIII hemi swaps

I haven't chased that dream much. Intake,carb, and some kind of ignition work around?

 

[Rat Bastid]

Isn't this where the Gen III Hemi can come into play?? The block is strong! And the heads are pretty good as well. And, it's a small block mopar. Wouldn't it be cheaper to obtain 600 hp at a much lesser cost on all motor ?? 6.4 is a monster with just a cam swap - carb intakes out there too. Holley really supports the GenIII hemi swaps

If we talking NA then no, the Hemi is not the answer unless you like big RPM. NA Hemi’s are pigs. This is not unknown but appears to be a mystery in certain circles.

If anyone is unclear on this look at the flow path of air through an in line wedge, the various canted wedge heads and then the Hemi. It should be obvious when look at the flow path.

 

[B3422w5]

It looks like Crower's website doesn't show them for the W5s, but a man might call them and see if they still make them. Jesel shows them in their catalog and I couldn't find the T&D catalog (they want you to fill out a form to order or call them).

I ran the jesel sportsman series rockers on my W5’s( believe I was the first to do so)….Ryan and others at that point were not aware the heads needed shaved around 250 thou to bolt the stands to. Had never seen those before.
the geometry is excellent, those are still in use to this day, btw.

 

['68cuda416]

Isn't this where the Gen III Hemi can come into play?? The block is strong! And the heads are pretty good as well. And, it's a small block mopar. Wouldn't it be cheaper to obtain 600 hp at a much lesser cost on all motor ?? 6.4 is a monster with just a cam swap - carb intakes out there too. Holley really supports the GenIII hemi swaps

Gen 3 Hemi belongs in modern cars and it certainly is not cheap to build....kinda reminds me of the LS lore though.....buy a junk yard LS and or now it seems junk yard Hemi for 400 bucks and make instant 1000 hp. It just gets better every day around here, LOL

 

[318willrun]

I haven't chased that dream much. Intake,carb, and some kind of ignition work around?

Pretty much......

If we talking NA then no, the Hemi is not the answer unless you like big RPM. NA Hemi’s are pigs. This is not unknown but appears to be a mystery in certain circles.

If anyone is unclear on this look at the flow path of air through an in line wedge, the various canted wedge heads and then the Hemi. It should be obvious when look at the flow path.

I think 600+ hp comes cheaper with a Gen III than you'd get from buying a LA version of a "race block", with all your "W" heads & valve train & intake. Not to mention what you'd use for internals. In fact, proof is under the hoods all over the place.

 

[318willrun]

6.4 Hemi, factory 485 "NET" hp. Tell me what that is in our dyno "GROSS" hp please. So we are around 550+ hp ??? bone stock and idling smooth??? Cam swap and good exhaust and we are over 600 hp.
You can "not" like it. You can defy it in our "older vehicles". You can stomp in front of the mirror. But in reality, you cannot get as much hp cheaper with same reliability with a "LA" build. And yes, I'm a realist. Sorry. The fastest, most powerful small blocks to EVER be produced in a factory mopar is the Gen III hemi's. Facts are facts, even if somebody doesn't like them.

 

['68cuda416]

6.4 Hemi, factory 485 "NET" hp. Tell me what that is in our dyno "GROSS" hp please. So we are around 550+ hp ??? bone stock and idling smooth??? Cam swap and good exhaust and we are over 600 hp.
You can "not" like it. You can defy it in our "older vehicles". You can stomp in front of the mirror. But in reality, you cannot get as much hp cheaper with same reliability with a "LA" build. And yes, I'm a realist. Sorry. LOL.....I just must be lucky I guess.....I smoked those tanks when I had my little 415" Indy T/A engine.....by a lot!!!! Destroyed the Hell

 

['68cuda416]

I smoked those Gen 3 Hemi tanks with my little 415" LA stroker on pump gas, lol, even at the track I gapped those turds so bad it was embarrassing......NEVER IN MY LIFETIME will I ever have a Gen 3 Hemi in one of my real hot rods because I don't like a smooth idle and I also don't like how ugly that engine is and furthermore it reminds me of what Gov't builds with all their emissions and computer this and that and I detest it....bonus on the cake is I can flat beat 98% of ANY Gen 3 Hemi to line up on a dragstrip.

 

[318willrun]

Facts are Facts .... Sorry, this is what I see

 

['68cuda416]

Facts are Facts .... Sorry, this is what I see

How did the NNN's go for ya? Was that like a 16 second 1/8th mile.......hard to tell because there were soooo many fast heads up big money cars there that they weren't showing any times......OR......was it that maybe it was to soften the blow of realization to so many? HMMMMMM

 

[toolmanmike]

I smoked those Gen 3 Hemi tanks with my little 415" LA stroker on pump gas, lol, even at the track I gapped those turds so bad it was embarrassing......NEVER IN MY LIFETIME will I ever have a Gen 3 Hemi in one of my real hot rods because I don't like a smooth idle and I also don't like how ugly that engine is and furthermore it reminds me of what Gov't builds with all their emissions and computer this and that and I detest it....bonus on the cake is I can flat beat 98% of ANY Gen 3 Hemi to line up on a dragstrip.

A 6.4 liter Gen 3 is only 390 cubes and how many cars have 5.7's (347 cubes) under the hood. A modified 415 stroker should perform better than a 5.7 Gen 3 but it might be a stretch to run up against a modified 6.4. You might be the one getting your *** waxed.

 

['68cuda416]

A 6.4 liter Gen 3 is only 390 cubes and how many cars have 5.7's under the hood. A modified 415 stroker should perform better than a 5.7 Gen 3 but it might be a stretch to run up against a modified 6.4. You might be the one getting your *** waxed.

I beat multiple Hellcats at Tulsa Dragway at the Mopar event a few years ago with that little 415", now we obviously have quite a bit more....but that weekend I ran a 10.48 @ 126....to date I have never been beaten by any modern Challenger or Charger....it can happen as there are some that are highly modified and run very hard but that's why I said 98% of them would be getting gapped.

 

[toolmanmike]

I beat multiple Hellcats at Tulsa Dragway at the Mopar event a few years ago with that little 415", now we obviously have quite a bit more....but that weekend I ran a 10.48 @ 126....to date I have never been beaten by any modern Challenger or Charger....it can happen as there are some that are highly modified and run very hard but that's why I said 98% of them would be getting gapped.

And 98% of them couldn't get the power to the ground. I have seen dozens of late model Challengers that just can't hook.

 

[volaredon]

Ok have a question
All this talk about absolutely highest flowing heads available (no matter what engine or brand)
I understand that improved flow and velocity will help any engine, all else being equal. But is it really mandatory to get that last 1/4 cfm of airflow possible Out Of ANY engine of a given size? Any cam? Any CR? Built for any purpose?
Does it make as much difference on say a 360 built for a tow rig as it does on a 360 in a dedicated 1/4 mile race car seeking to eke out that last 10th???

 

['68cuda416]

And 98% of them couldn't get the power to the ground. I have seen dozens of late model Challengers that just can't hook.

Not the case, at least not in how you are referencing it.....the 2 Hellcats had 15" drag radials on them same as myself. Also they should have less trouble getting power to the ground with all their traction control and such whereas little old me is still using 30 year old suspension technology.

 

[318willrun]

And 98% of them couldn't get the power to the ground. I have seen dozens of late model Challengers that just can't hook.

And all of this because I stated in my opinion the Gen III hemi is the mopar small block that can get you on the plus side of 600 hp the cheapest and still be reliable. I wasn't even talking about the challengers/chargers they came in. Those are over 4,000 lbs. I was strictly talking about the topic the OP started in the thread.

 

[cookietruck]

hellcats weight like 4500lbs don't they?

the original context of the genIII hemi was making roughly 600hp in regard to ease and expense. i think it'd be a better comparison to take some LA motor and some genIII hemi and use them in the same chassis. power is power, i think 318willrun made a good point. strong block, good heads, availability. at some point it does make sense to consider the genIII. maybe not if you already have a ton of LA motor parts, but if someone was starting from close to scratch and spending 10-15k on an LA motor is in the near future...

 

[gzig5]

Hellcat's weigh around 4300 pounds I think so they are at an immediate disadvantage against any late 60's to early 70's car on a weight basis. Probably 1000 pound difference to a typical A-body? Comparing power output this way is apples to watermelons IMO.