pishta
I know I'm right....
Nascar has LH lug nuts on these new cars driver side wheels now. Wonder why? 
Left hand lug nuts are back, baby!
- Thread starter pishta
- Start date
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Inertia
Well-Known Member
To stop the left ones from loosening on braking .
I bought a TVR for my wife, had wire wheel knock-offs, the left front wheel left the car twice before I figured out the cause , front hubs were on the wrong sides.
I bought a TVR for my wife, had wire wheel knock-offs, the left front wheel left the car twice before I figured out the cause , front hubs were on the wrong sides.
Unconventional
Well-Known Member
They're playin' "Keep up wit F1"
IRS now also.
Brief time I watched today, 1 pit crew didn't reverse the gun when they go to the left side and either boogered up the nut or the spindle causing severe issues. Driver give the wall a kiss and knocks the RR out of alignment spooky handling to follow.
IRS now also.
Brief time I watched today, 1 pit crew didn't reverse the gun when they go to the left side and either boogered up the nut or the spindle causing severe issues. Driver give the wall a kiss and knocks the RR out of alignment spooky handling to follow.
Because they're using a single nut instead of 5 and the larger the nut the more likely it is to get rotational input from the wheel?
You don't need to reverse the direction if you've got a multiple bolt pattern with relatively small diameter lugs. Which is why millions and millions of cars with standard lugs don't have wheels falling off constantly.
You don't need to reverse the direction if you've got a multiple bolt pattern with relatively small diameter lugs. Which is why millions and millions of cars with standard lugs don't have wheels falling off constantly.
Chrysler didn't think it up, not even close. It was a left over from much earlier cars that used spindle mount wheels, and as such had wheels retained by a single, large spindle nut.
The single nut arrangement means that the nut is at the center of the axis, just like the wheel, so the wheel spinning in the opposite direction as the threads can be an issue. So with large knock off style spindle nuts they had the threads run the other way.
When you use a multi-bolt pattern, the lugs are not at the center of the axle anymore. And their smaller size makes them less effected by the rotation of the wheel than a large single nut.
All Chrysler did was stick with it long after everyone else realized it was completely unnecessary when you go away from a single spindle nut retention system. It came back to Nascar because they went back to a single nut retention system for their wheels.
You won't see it come back to production vehicles with a multi-bolt pattern.
Topless69
Well-Known Member
It was a lousy idea and added absolutely no extra measure of safety.
It did however lead to untold cases of people snapping off lug bolts thinking they were loosening the nut.
But when they do most are on the left side. Every time I've seen a trailer loose a wheel it's been on the left side.
Also aren't ring gear bolts still L/H?
It was a great idea, sound engineering, but stupid people negated any benefit.
Some will never get it.....
It was a safety device & if it saved one life or accident, it was worth it. LH thread on left side tends to self tighten....& keep the wheel on.
I do believe there were others that used the LH threads. VW?
It was a safety device & if it saved one life or accident, it was worth it. LH thread on left side tends to self tighten....& keep the wheel on.
I do believe there were others that used the LH threads. VW?
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
"I don't know." Even big over the road trucks trailers used them when I sold parts back in the 70's. So I'll ask this:
'Far's I know GM did not use them. So how come you don't see hoards of GM cars along the sides of the road with one side wheels fell off?
How 'bout lawn mower/ small engine/ outboard flywheels? I've never seen one with a "left nut" and they never come loose..................
'Far's I know GM did not use them. So how come you don't see hoards of GM cars along the sides of the road with one side wheels fell off?
How 'bout lawn mower/ small engine/ outboard flywheels? I've never seen one with a "left nut" and they never come loose..................
autoxcuda
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I think they are trying to increase safety by not have 5 lugs and having 1 or 2 left loose.
And I wonder if it reduces the pit crew size somehow… which saves cost.
mopar head
Well-Known Member
My 68 ford f-350 has them. Learned my lesson on that truck. I was 30 at the time.
Lucky I gave up before I snapped one.
Next day at work lunch room I was complaining about and a guy spoke up and asked what year. therefor was schooled.
Cuda Al
Well-Known Member
I never bought into the lug-nuts (5, not center knockoff) coming loose.
The idea of a single knockoff coming loose I can see as it is spinning on the same axis as the wheel and I could see the inertia of the nut (especially with the wings) working it loose.
But a lug nut off center and with virtually no mass, I say show me the engineering report or the calculations, just not buying it. It being so negligible it was probably why it was ultimately dropped.
Alan
The idea of a single knockoff coming loose I can see as it is spinning on the same axis as the wheel and I could see the inertia of the nut (especially with the wings) working it loose.
But a lug nut off center and with virtually no mass, I say show me the engineering report or the calculations, just not buying it. It being so negligible it was probably why it was ultimately dropped.
Alan
Ive seen the Chrysler engineering video that someone posted 15+ years ago, but I couldn’t find it years later when searching for it. It’s not about properly torqued lug nuts, it’s about under torqued or lug nuts that are left loose. They will continue to loosen on the left side with R/H thread, but not with L/H thread.
You can actually prove it yourself.
If you have a car with LH nuts on the DS, next time you put a wheel on, just finger tighten the nuts.
The wheel will not come off.
Try that with RH nuts on the DS.
The wheel will be off sometime around the second or third corner you go around and will likely be wobbling before that.
If you have a car with LH nuts on the DS, next time you put a wheel on, just finger tighten the nuts.
The wheel will not come off.
Try that with RH nuts on the DS.
The wheel will be off sometime around the second or third corner you go around and will likely be wobbling before that.
The wheel won’t come off huh? You don’t think the wheel wobbling around on the studs won’t break them? Maybe the nuts won’t loosen further, but you’re sadly mistaken if you think finger tight lug nuts won’t cause other problems up to and including catastrophic failure.
Or you can just tighten your lug nuts like you’re supposed to and never have an issue. Like the millions and millions of cars on the road that don't use LH threads.
If it was actually a problem you can bet your *** someone would have started a class action lawsuit over it. Even if it was an exceedingly minor problem some lawyer would have jumped all over it by now. Yeah, for a spindle mounted wheel with a single nut or knock off at the center of the axle it can be an issue. For a multi-lug pattern that’s off the center of the axle it accomplishes nothing that properly torqued lug nuts doesn’t already accomplish. Which is why pretty much no one has done it since Chrysler in the 70’s. And most everyone else well before that because Chrysler was one of the last hold outs.
And yes, there have been studies done on this. If the lug nuts are loose they can continue to loosen on the left side of the car with right hand threads. But if the lug nuts are tight they won't loosen because of the rotation of the wheel. And loose lug nuts cause other issues that can cause failure.
Well that's a slippery slope isn't it? By that logic every vehicle made should have a breathalyzer interlock, you'd save hundreds of thousands of lives preventing drunk driving. Or maybe every car should come with a GPS tied governor so you can't ever exceed the posted speed limit? Distance sensors that prevent you from tailgating? Oh, wait, self driving cars have already been proven to be safer per mile than the average driver (not 100% safe, but safer than the average human) so we should probably just make all cars self driving. And of course in all of these scenarios banning older vehicles would be necessary, because I'm sure there's many lives that have been lost when a classic was involved in an accident that wouldn't have been fatal in a modern vehicle.
Properly torque your lug nuts and it will never be an issue.
If they are finger tight, there's no wobble.
...and there won't be (unlike RH thread on the left side) because they will tend to tighten (or at least maintain the current level of torque).
I stand by my statement.
...and there won't be (unlike RH thread on the left side) because they will tend to tighten (or at least maintain the current level of torque).
I stand by my statement.
What, where your lug nuts loosened on the driver's side of the vehicle? I don't doubt it, if the lugs are not properly torqued they can loosen. Never said they couldn't.
But if they're properly torqued they don't loosen. And if they're not properly torqued but on the passenger side of the vehicle they won't tighten either, because that force is TINY. Which means eventually you will have an issue, because finger tight lug nuts do allow for vibration that will destroy the studs eventually.
Do you take your modern cars down to the shop and have all their lug studs replaced? Or do you just make sure the lugs are torqued?
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