What is the "perfect" street/strip package......for the average Moparian

[rumblefish360]

Yeah I too get puzzled when I see so many replies that say its not a good street/strip package but a 12 or 13 second car is.........HUH?????

It’s kind of what Arron says. Most low 13/12 second cars are standard displacement sized and built with Hyd cams and mid compression ratios for easy pump gas use and near zero maintenance. They mimic what was done in the 80’s & 90’s when many of the board were just out of or in high school. That was pretty bad *** back then for a teenager to have.

The engines & cars required very little to keep going and when track time came around, they were not so high strung as to not be able to drive to the track and back. An occasional light to light run was done or where I grew up, the back alleys of industrial parks or very late night Hwy runs. A quick hit if and quit it, get the hell out of there deal.

I myself have a 4spd manual that was my double duty car for a long time. I wasn’t to keen on it when the cam duration was in the upper 240’s or low 250’s in the car.
The biggest limiting factor was the final drive of 1:1. It just wasn’t that great with a 50 mile round trip into work where at least half of that was stop and go bumper to bumper traffic for an 1-1/2 hours.

For that, I ended up swapping out the double duty ‘Cuda for my ‘79 Magnum with A/C, bolt on performance parts and a mild Hyd cam. While not exactly exciting… LOL, it did have good Hwy and mileage manor’s with good passing abilities.

In the end, it’s really what gets the job done for the person behind the wheel and what there living around.

 

['68cuda416]

It’s kind of what Arron says. Most low 13/12 second cars are standard displacement sized and built with Hyd cams and mid compression ratios for easy pump gas use and near zero maintenance. They mimic what was done in the 80’s & 90’s when many of the board were just out of or in high school. That was pretty bad *** back then for a teenager to have.

The engines & cars required very little to keep going and when track time came around, they were not so high strung as to not be able to drive to the track and back. An occasional light to light run was done or where I grew up, the back alleys of industrial parks or very late night Hwy runs. A quick hit if and quit it, get the hell out of there deal.

I myself have a 4spd manual that was my double duty car for a long time. I wasn’t to keen on it when the cam duration was in the upper 240’s or low 250’s in the car.
The biggest limiting factor was the final drive of 1:1. It just wasn’t that great with a 50 mile round trip into work where at least half of that was stop and go bumper to bumper traffic for an 1-1/2 hours.

For that, I ended up swapping out the double duty ‘Cuda for my ‘79 Magnum with A/C, bolt on performance parts and a mild Hyd cam. While not exactly exciting… LOL, it did have good Hwy and mileage manor’s with good passing abilities.

In the end, it’s really what gets the job done for the person behind the wheel and what there living around.

I think most would choose to not put 50 miles one way to work on their very nice or restored Mopar because too much time on the road and possibility of something happening and they are worth too much to use like that. There are some guys that do build their cars for that purpose but they are almost never valuable cars to begin with. I enjoy working on and tweaking on one to hopefully get it running better or working better so the very very little maintenace I have to do on it is actually less than most peoples daily drivers......but I don't use cheap, junk *** parts either so maybe my luck is different than others experience.

 

[Ottmundr]

I think most would choose to not put 50 miles one way to work on their very nice or restored Mopar because too much time on the road and possibility of something happening and they are worth too much to use like that. There are some guys that do build their cars for that purpose but they are almost never valuable cars to begin with. I enjoy working on and tweaking on one to hopefully get it running better or working better so the very very little maintenace I have to do on it is actually less than most peoples daily drivers......but I don't use cheap, junk *** parts either so maybe my luck is different than others experience.

I have a 50 mile commute and the only reasons I won't drive my barracuda every day is the 4.10 gears and the charger has super cold air conditioning and the cruise control and the stereo and the brakes and so on and so forth.

Putting miles on the barracuda is NOT an issue. It's not like I can enjoy it when I'm dead. Cars are to be driven and enjoyed, not pampered like some death mask of King Tutankhamun or a dinosaur skeleton in a museum.

 

['68cuda416]

I have a 5


I have a 50 mile commute and the only reasons I won't drive my barracuda every day is the 4.10 gears and the charger has super cold air conditioning and the cruise control and the stereo and the brakes and so on and so forth.

Putting miles on the barracuda is NOT an issue. It's not like I can enjoy it when I'm dead. Cars are to be driven and enjoyed, not pampered like some death mask of King Tutankhamun or a dinosaur skeleton in a museum.

I could care less about A/C and stereo and never ever on any of my cars will it ever be installed.....I don't like cluttered bullshit so no A/C, no power steering, no aftermarket radio and speaker nonsense, no power brakes......just simple badass......and all I can conclude from our differences of why one would and one wouldn't drive 50 miles one way each day is must be my cars are nicer and I want to keep them that way and you are right I do view them as King Tut's mask and I actually sleep beside my cars sometimes i'm so in love with them.

 

[justinp61]

I could care less about A/C and stereo and never ever on any of my cars will it ever be installed.....I don't like cluttered bullshit so no A/C, no power steering, no aftermarket radio and speaker nonsense, no power brakes......just simple badass......and all I can conclude from our differences of why one would and one wouldn't drive 50 miles one way each day is must be my cars are nicer and I want to keep them that way and you are right I do view them as King Tut's mask and I actually sleep beside my cars sometimes i'm so in love with them.

Your wife locks you outta the house sometimes too?

 

['68cuda416]

Your wife locks you outta the house sometimes too?

girlfriend......but yeah something like that, lol

 

[Oldiron440]

The idea of a “stroker” being high maintenance is ridiculous just because of an increase in the stroke. Back in the 90s I knew a couple of guys that built 4.15 stroke 440s for there tow vehicles and had no problems, drove and maintained them like a 440, the motor home is still pulling his kids and grandkids to the track.

 

[autoxcuda]

The idea of a “stroker” being high maintenance is ridiculous just because of an increase in the stroke. Back in the 90s I knew a couple of guys that built 4.15 stroke 440s for there tow vehicles and had no problems, drove and maintained them like a 440, the motor home is still pulling his kids and grandkids to the track.

It's not the maintenance due to being a stroker. It's the maintaining the tune with the carb with the cam that will support 550-600hp in a 4" stroke SB combo. It's more than time, it's the knowledge too. The stall will help though.

What takes this out of the average person is the costs involved to actually utilize the 550-600 horsepower on the street.

What was mentioned:

• Caltracs
• custom 904 built to take 550-600hp
• double adjustable drag shocks
• good 8" stall converter
• good valvetrain to support cam lifts that provide 550-600hp
• Dana rear end?
• Driveshaft that supports 550-600hp

... the incidental supporting cast of parts have some expensive bills

 

[justinp61]

It's the the maintenance due to being a stroker. It's the maintaining the tune with the carb with the cam that will support 550-600hp in a 4" stroke SB combo. It's more than time, it's the knowledge too. The stall will help though.

What takes this out of the average person is the costs involved to actually utilize the 550-600 horsepower on the street.

What was mentioned:

• Caltracs
• custom 904 built to take 550-600hp
• double adjustable drag shocks
• good 8" stall converter
• good valvetrain to support cam lifts that provide 550-600hp
• Dana rear end?
• Driveshaft that supports 550-600hp

... the incidental supporting cast of parts have some expensive bills

Have you ever built and owned a stroker? Tuning and maintaining one is no different than any other high performance engine.

You have got to love the internet.

 

['68cuda416]

It's the the maintenance due to being a stroker. It's the maintaining the tune with the carb with the cam that will support 550-600hp in a 4" stroke SB combo. It's more than time, it's the knowledge too. The stall will help though.

What takes this out of the average person is the costs involved to actually utilize the 550-600 horsepower on the street.

What was mentioned:

• Caltracs
• custom 904 built to take 550-600hp
• double adjustable drag shocks
• good 8" stall converter
• good valvetrain to support cam lifts that provide 550-600hp
• Dana rear end?
• Driveshaft that supports 550-600hp

... the incidental supporting cast of parts have some expensive bills

Well I am just listing what it actually takes or one of the ways to do it so that your car isn't broke down with torn up parts every time you lay into it......I bought good parts and had zero breakage. Point being is almost every engine build and or car build the owners will start off saying they want this kind of power OR MORE which is fine if you can afford it......there is more to a car than just the engine and I know you already understand that but you get what i'm saying. This was not a high end build or even an extravagant build in my opinion........but what it was, was a proper build that didn't have mismatched parts and performed as it should have and stayed together as one would always hope for.

 

['68cuda416]

Have you ever built and owned a stroker? Tuning and maintaining one is no different than any other high performance engine.

You have got to love the internet.

Yeah I don't understand that part either

 

[autoxcuda]

Have you ever built and owned a stroker? Tuning and maintaining one is no different than any other high performance engine.

You have got to love the internet.

Yes, for 11 years. Driven regularly.

It has nothing to do with the stroke.

Maintaining a 1.4hp/cu-in is different than 1hp/cu-in or less motor that's regularly driven on the street for the average Mopar owner.

Back when MP sold those 380hp crate motors.... most people had eyes bigger than the stomach and bought those instead of the 300hp. And sure enough year or two later customers come back asking about dual planes, EFI, other ways to detune them. This is from ns1rm21 that was a top seller of those at Westoaks MP.

 

['68cuda416]

Yes, for 11 years. Driven regularly.

It has nothing to do with the stroke.

Maintaining a 1.4hp/cu-in is different than 1hp/cu-in or less motor that's regularly driven on the street for the average Mopar owner.

Back when MP sold those 380hp crate motors.... most people had eyes bigger than the stomach and bought those instead of the 300hp. And sure enough year or two later customers come back asking about dual planes, EFI, other ways to detune them. This is from ns1rm21 that was a top seller of those at Westoaks MP.

Wow.....must have been some real weenies to complain about 380hp engines being to much power and hard to keep in tune. I suggest they go buy a gov't built car so all the thinking has been done for them.

 

[autoxcuda]

Well I am just listing what it actually takes or one of the ways to do it so that your car isn't broke down with torn up parts every time you lay into it......I bought good parts and had zero breakage. Point being is almost every engine build and or car build the owners will start off saying they want this kind of power OR MORE which is fine if you can afford it......there is more to a car than just the engine and I know you already understand that but you get what i'm saying. This was not a high end build or even an extravagant build in my opinion........but what it was, was a proper build that didn't have mismatched parts and performed as it should have and stayed together as one would always hope for.

Yes, you are laying down all the part that go with it. That's great. So people understand it's much more than just a motor being dropped off in your garage. You need to consider the whole system. I applaud you for laying that out.

To YOU it is not a high end build and all the parts that go with it. You are in a different position than the average Mopar owner. Great for you. Nothing wrong with that.

To the average Mopar owner all that stuff is.

 

[autoxcuda]

Wow.....must have been some real weenies to complain about 380hp engines being to much power and hard to keep in tune. I suggest they go buy a gov't built car so all the thinking has been done for them.

It is what it is. Good, bad, indifferent...

That was the reality. That's the average guy.

 

['68cuda416]

Yes, you are laying down all the part that go with it. That's great. So people understand it's much more than just a motor being dropped off in your garage. You need to consider the whole system. I applaud you for laying that out.

To YOU it is not a high end build and all the parts that go with it. You are in a different position than the average Mopar owner. Great for you. Nothing wrong with that.

To the average Mopar owner all that stuff is.

I won't split hairs over whether it's an average build or not....but it also would be nice if guys wouldn't have delusional hopes and dreams then if all they can afford in reality is 5 quarts of oil, a filter and a used swap meet intake.

 

['68cuda416]

It is what it is. Good, bad, indifferent...

That was the reality. That's the average guy.

Again this is probably my opinion exclusively, lol, but I would rather knowing what I know now start off with the 550-600 deal and have to grow into it and probably not be bored with it as easily if a guy builds a 375hp setup.....i'm guessing he grows bored of it quickly and then he ends up having to reinvent the whole car to support more power.....my 2 cents

 

[autoxcuda]

I won't split hairs over whether it's an average build or not....but it also would be nice if guys wouldn't have delusional hopes and dreams then if all they can afford in reality is 5 quarts of oil, a filter and a used swap meet intake.

This is true.

That's why it was great of you to list the major chassis parts that go WITH a 550-600hp motor. It's a financial and build commitment to the whole car to support that motor.

 

[fishmens67]

It has to be a stroked low deck big block.
Way easier to get 550-600 HP. and pretty tame at that.

 

[autoxcuda]

Again this is probably my opinion exclusively, lol, but I would rather knowing what I know now start off with the 550-600 deal and have to grow into it and probably not be bored with it as easily if a guy builds a 375hp setup.....i'm guessing he grows bored of it quickly and then he ends up having to reinvent the whole car to support more power.....my 2 cents

Don't discount your experience.

You gained knowledge along the way to put you in the place you're in.

 

['68cuda416]

It has to be a stroked low deck big block.
Way easier to get 550-600 HP. and pretty tame at that.

I have only had 2 experiences with a big block and the first one was a 440 in a 64 Belvedere wagon with headers and that was the most miserable experience I have ever had changing plugs, lol, second one was in my 65 Belvedere post with a 493" and after a couple seasons of my father racing it the crank broke and we just converted the car over to a healthy small block stroker.....for me I find the small blocks easier to work on and I like simple on my cars.

 

[fishmens67]

I have only had 2 experiences with a big block and the first one was a 440 in a 64 Belvedere wagon with headers and that was the most miserable experience I have ever had changing plugs, lol, second one was in my 65 Belvedere post with a 493" and after a couple seasons of my father racing it the crank broke and we just converted the car over to a healthy small block stroker.....for me I find the small blocks easier to work on and I like simple on my cars.

I'm only going to tell you once. lol
If I had the coin , I'd want what you have in your 68 Fast back, a well put together car. sweet!

 

[justinp61]

It's the the maintenance due to being a stroker. It's the maintaining the tune with the carb with the cam that will support 550-600hp in a 4" stroke SB combo. It's more than time, it's the knowledge too. The stall will help though.

What takes this out of the average person is the costs involved to actually utilize the 550-600 horsepower on the street.

What was mentioned:

• Caltracs
• custom 904 built to take 550-600hp
• double adjustable drag shocks
• good 8" stall converter
• good valvetrain to support cam lifts that provide 550-600hp
• Dana rear end?
• Driveshaft that supports 550-600hp

... the incidental supporting cast of parts have some expensive bills

Yes, for 11 years. Driven regularly.

It has nothing to do with the stroke.

Maintaining a 1.4hp/cu-in is different than 1hp/cu-in or less motor that's regularly driven on the street for the average Mopar owner.

Back when MP sold those 380hp crate motors.... most people had eyes bigger than the stomach and bought those instead of the 300hp. And sure enough year or two later customers come back asking about dual planes, EFI, other ways to detune them. This is from ns1rm21 that was a top seller of those at Westoaks MP.

Okay, which one is it? My first car was a 65 dart with an 273. The valves had to be adjusted on the 273 more often than either my 408 or 434. Plus the dealing with the points that seemed to burn up at least twice a year.

As I posted before I run the valves once a year on my 434, they’ve never been off more than .001” and that could easily be me. The cam is a solid roller, 263/271 a .050”, .711/.719” at the retainers after lash. Hell, it hasn’t had a timing light on it in years and I’d be willing to bet it’s still right.

Good parts cost the same for a 340 as they do for a stroker. I have the 727 that was behind my 340 and I wouldn’t hesitate to use it behind the 434. My 408 did break the 8 3/4 on the second pass it hooked up, 1.38 60’ was just more than it could take.

Anyone that can tune a 273 or a 318 can tune a stroker, it’s not rocket science.

 

['68cuda416]

I'm only going to tell you once. lol
If I had the coin , I'd want what you have in your 68 Fast back, a well put together car. sweet!

Back then it was a 415" Indy Brock engine and now it's a 434" W9 setup.....to be honest I wish I left well enough alone.

 

[autoxcuda]

Okay, which one is it? My first car was a 65 dart with an 273. The valves had to be adjusted on the 273 more often than either my 408 or 434. Plus the dealing with the points that seemed to burn up at least twice a year.

As I posted before I run the valves once a year on my 434, they’ve never been off more than .001” and that could easily be me. The cam is a solid roller, 263/271 a .050”, .711/.719” at the retainers after lash. Hell, it hasn’t had a timing light on it in years and I’d be willing to bet it’s still right.

Good parts cost the same for a 340 as they do for a stroker. I have the 727 that was behind my 340 and I wouldn’t hesitate to use it behind the 434. My 408 did break the 8 3/4 on the second pass it hooked up, 1.38 60’ was just more than it could take.

Anyone that can tune a 273 or a 318 can tune a stroker, it’s not rocket science.

My bad. Mistype or an autocorrect. Notice the two "the"

It's nothing to do with the stroke. It's the maintaining the tune with the HP/cu in. And rest of the car thought out and part purchased, installed properly to put the 550-600hp to ground and actually use it.

It's probably not a for the person building their first motor. Or never got deep into a carb changing hard parts for performance and tune.